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Old 14.11.2011, 10:01
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Re: Coop caught selling old meat as new

Choose your cow and get it sent ASAP - can´t get any fresher than that - http://www.mycow.de/

http://www.thelocal.de/society/20111104-38645.html

5kg for EUR75 plus EUR15 shipping to Konstanz / Basel border area for beef.
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Old 14.11.2011, 10:04
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What gets me, is that in all the pictures they show about Coop getting caught selling old me as new there is somebody holding meat without a glove or a utensil.
This doesn't bother me as much as incorrect storage, for example. Coop meat counters don't handle money so there is no contamination there. As long as there are hand washing facilities in use, there is little risk from clean, ungloved hands.

I think I have read on here a link showing that people who use gloves are less precise with their hygiene, relying on a false sense of security with the gloves or tongs.

In all of this stupid episode and high indignance by the media somehow trying to scaremonger I haven't read of any outbreaks of food poisoning.

If there had been outbreaks of E-Coli or Salmonella I think I would have been slightly more concerned.

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Choose your cow and get it sent ASAP - can´t get any fresher than that - http://www.mycow.de/

http://www.thelocal.de/society/20111104-38645.html

5kg for EUR75 plus EUR15 shipping to Konstanz / Basel border area for beef.
Fresh beef?? No thanks - why doesn't anyone mature the meat any more? Slaughter house to plate in an afternoon
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  #43  
Old 14.11.2011, 10:10
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Re: Coop caught selling old meat as new

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This doesn't bother me as much as incorrect storage, for example. Coop meat counters don't handle money so there is no contamination there. As long as there are hand washing facilities in use, there is little risk from clean, ungloved hands.

I think I have read on here a link showing that people who use gloves are less precise with their hygiene, relying on a false sense of security with the gloves or tongs.

In all of this stupid episode and high indignance by the media somehow trying to scaremonger I haven't read of any outbreaks of food poisoning.

If there had been outbreaks of E-Coli or Salmonella I think I would have been slightly more concerned.



Fresh beef?? No thanks - why doesn't anyone mature the meat any more? Slaughter house to plate in an afternoon
Well, for one, the media here does a fine, fine job at downplaying and under-reporting anything. I once observed a lady stocking shelves, when she was called to the meat counter. She didn't wash her hands, handled meat, then went over to the cheese counter to cut up some cheese with the same knife and then went back to the meat counter.
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Old 14.11.2011, 10:17
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Re: Coop caught selling old meat as new

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Well, for one, the media here does a fine, fine job at downplaying and under-reporting anything. I once observed a lady stocking shelves, when she was called to the meat counter. She didn't wash her hands, handled meat, then went over to the cheese counter to cut up some cheese with the same knife and then went back to the meat counter.
I've never seen anyone slicing cheese in a supermarket with a knife. They have a cheese slicer...

I'm not saying there aren't flaws in the process, same as everywhere else, but the point is that correct hygiene does not preclude handling meat with ungloved hands.

You have to admit the system can't be that bad otherwise people would be dropping like flies. Sometimes you have to not dwell on the isolated incidents and look at the bigger picture.

The media would lose even more face if they reported every tittle-tattle tale that the great public reported to them.
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Old 14.11.2011, 10:19
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Re: Coop caught selling old meat as new

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I've never seen anyone slicing cheese in a supermarket with a knife. They have a cheese slicer...

I'm not saying there aren't flaws in the process, same as everywhere else, but the point is that correct hygiene does not preclude handling meat with ungloved hands.

You have to admit the system can't be that bad otherwise people would be dropping like flies. Sometimes you have to not dwell on the isolated incidents and look at the bigger picture.

The media would lose even more face if they reported every tittle-tattle tale that the great public reported to them.
Well, IMO, Switzerland should drop the 3rd world process and get up date (ah yes, where to start, where to start).....mind you, people are not dropping like flies, but they do tend to get sick fairly frequently.
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Old 14.11.2011, 10:34
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Well, IMO, Switzerland should drop the 3rd world process and get up date (ah yes, where to start, where to start).....mind you, people are not dropping like flies, but they do tend to get sick fairly frequently.
Ah, yes but if you solved the "draught" problem, the health of the population would improve overnight, never mind the food processes...
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  #47  
Old 14.11.2011, 11:27
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Re: Coop caught selling old meat as new

it is very 'he said, she said' and mostly disgruntled ex-employees are pretty unreliable witnesses.

Even if it did occur, this is such an isolated incident and comes down to crappy management in one branch of Coop, which in my opinion far surpasses Migros for quality.

So far as Swiss use by dates go, I have noticed a lot of anomalies lately. If I buy identically packaged Uncle Ben's rice, Bonne Maman jam, spices and herbs etc in a French supermarket the same week as I do in a Swiss one, the use by dates in France are up to even 2 years further away.

Going by the amount of wastage we have in Switzerland and my nose telling me that products are still fine, either the supermarkets here are storing their foods for way too long before putting them on the shelves, or their is a supermarket conspiracy going on where they stamp an early date so we have to buy more.
food hygiene in Switzerland, like the toilet hygiene is generally far higher than any other country I know. Though admittedly, when I briefly worked at a McDonalds here, the staff broke all of the rules that we would have been sacked for breaking back in the old country.
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Old 14.11.2011, 11:37
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Re: Coop caught selling old meat as new

To my mind, the "wastage" issue that was talked about in the Sunday newspapers (Coop and Migros complaining that they are having to throw out up to 6% of meat) is really a red herring.

In any of the Coop stores that I frequent, as soon as they put a 25% or 50% sticker on the close dated product, it flies off the shelf. No wastage.

What Coop and Migros are worried about is their margin. Nothing else. Discounting products that have reached their due date has an impact for sure.

It just happened that Coop got caught this time because they were pushing things TOO far. When I hear that they were doing this as well for fish and cheese it really ticks me off.

We should see Coop being much more careful in the future as they really shot themselves in the foot over this very bad PR. Good on them.
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Old 14.11.2011, 11:58
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Re: Coop caught selling old meat as new

I am not surprised by this article. In the last 6 months of living in CH i have purchased three lots of meat from Coop all of which were totally inedible yet before their expiration dates.

I purchased a chicken on a Saturday, the expiration date was the following Monday. I opened it to cook that Saturday night and the underside of the chicken was GREEN and it absolutely stank. I returned it to Coop at the earliest opportunity, ie on the Monday and they refused to refund me as the day i returned it was the expiration date. Appauling customer service.

I have also bought inedible beef and salmon. What really annoys me is that they charge so much for their meat and yet it is a lottery as to whether the food is edible.
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  #50  
Old 14.11.2011, 12:04
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I have also bought inedible beef and salmon. What really annoys me is that they charge so much for their meat and yet it is a lottery as to whether the food is edible.
To be fair, I think "inedible" in this case is highly subjective without a lab to analyse whether the bacteria levels render the product unfit for human consumption.

Don't you perhaps mean "not to your taste"?

Sometimes meat which has been stored in plastic gives off a smell which is why I always take fresh meat out of its packaging and store it on a covered plate or in greaseproof paper.

Perhaps this is the "stink" you detected..?

In the past I have bought salmon which seemed to have been spoiled in the commercial freezing / defrosting process and had turned into a kind of mush after cooking. It wasn't "inedible" and certainly wouldn't have harmed me but the lack of texture and structure in the fish put me off and I chose not to eat it.
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Old 14.11.2011, 12:05
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Re: Coop caught selling old meat as new

I was under the impression that the meat in question was over the sell-by date - not rotten??
If you can spot that by just smelling, then you have an amazing nose!!

Also, I have been in CH for 18 years now and have never once had food poisoning. In the other countries I've lived in (UK, Spain, Greece) I had it at least a couple of times.
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Old 14.11.2011, 12:07
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Re: Coop caught selling old meat as new

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I am not surprised by this article. In the last 6 months of living in CH i have purchased three lots of meat from Coop all of which were totally inedible yet before their expiration dates.

I purchased a chicken on a Saturday, the expiration date was the following Monday. I opened it to cook that Saturday night and the underside of the chicken was GREEN and it absolutely stank. I returned it to Coop at the earliest opportunity, ie on the Monday and they refused to refund me as the day i returned it was the expiration date. Appauling customer service.

I have also bought inedible beef and salmon. What really annoys me is that they charge so much for their meat and yet it is a lottery as to whether the food is edible.
The price of meat in Switzerland is very reasonable when the income in considered. Studies show that the Switzerland offers the greatest potential in the world for saving money when taking the average income and the average cost of living.
I have to concur with these findings and I eat like royalty, only buying fresh Swiss meats when they are available.

I find it very hard to believe what you state about these inedible meats (I am not calling you a liar, I am actually finding it hard to believe). my experience with Swiss supermarket meats during the last seven years has been fantastic. The few 'less appealing' cuts of meat I have come across have come from a Migros but even then, my cooking was probably to blame.

I am going on the assumption that you stored that chicken properly.
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Old 14.11.2011, 12:09
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Re: Coop caught selling old meat as new

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Just to even things out - Migros has also been caught doing this in the past:

http://archives.24heures.ch/VQ/LAUSA...r-confirmer-le
I wonder how much pressure the local supermarkets have come under with the strong Frank and the fact that many Swiss are now crossing borders for their food. Also the discounters Lidl and Aldi have forced prices down here. I understand that Farmers and suppliers have to make a profit, but the price of meat here almost forces one to become vegetarian. I saw a pensioner in a local shop buy three kinds of sausage, this was probably his meat allowance for the week and it appears sad when it appears that the old guy can only buy or afford sausages.
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Old 14.11.2011, 12:10
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Re: Coop caught selling old meat as new

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In the past I have bought salmon which seemed to have been spoiled in the commercial freezing / defrosting process and had turned into a kind of mush after cooking. It wasn't "inedible" and certainly wouldn't have harmed me but the lack of texture and structure in the fish put me off and I chose not to eat it.
I had the same experience once. That is what comes from being so far from the sea. I just decided that I would leave fresh ocean fish (and Salmon) for holidays on coastlines. Plenty of nice freshwater fish around anyway.
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Old 14.11.2011, 12:14
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Re: Coop caught selling old meat as new

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I had the same experience once. That is what comes from being so far from the sea. I just decided that I would leave fresh ocean fish (and Salmon) for holidays on coastlines. Plenty of nice freshwater fish around anyway.
Yes, that's true.
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Old 14.11.2011, 12:15
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Re: Coop caught selling old meat as new

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I wonder how much pressure the local supermarkets have come under with the strong Frank and the fact that many Swiss are now crossing borders for their food. Also the discounters Lidl and Aldi have forced prices down here. I understand that Farmers and suppliers have to make a profit, but the price of meat here almost forces one to become vegetarian. I saw a pensioner in a local shop buy three kinds of sausage, this was probably his meat allowance for the week and it appears sad when it appears that the old guy can only buy or afford sausages.
Swiss love sausages! And you can't compare a Swiss sausage and the consumption thereof to the qualities of English/Aussie/NZ sausages which really are full of S___.
someone buying sausages here doesn't mean the price of meat is too high, it means they are having a grill or have a craving for a juicy Olma Bratwurst or Cervelat.

I never shop at Lidl or Aldi because I detest the disorganisation and queues. I do frequently travel to France to buy a bug lot of groceries but not because of the price, rather because I love the products they have (salted butters, Croque Monsieur, etc). I never by fresh meat of milk products there because the quality in Switzerland is too high. I also don't (and won't) go to Germany for better prices because the product range is as limited there as in Switzerland and the petrol/time costs outweigh the price difference anyway. Furthermore, I earn money in Switzerland, I spend in Switzerland. That is the honest way to go about it.
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Old 14.11.2011, 12:20
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Re: Coop caught selling old meat as new

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I never shop at Lidl or Aldi because I detest the disorganisation and queues. I do frequently travel to France to buy a bug lot of groceries but not because of the price, rather because I love the products they have (salted butters, Croque Monsieur, etc). I never by fresh meat of milk products there because the quality in Switzerland is too high. I also don't (and won't) go to Germany for better prices because the product range is as limited there as in Switzerland and the petrol/time costs outweigh the price difference anyway. Furthermore, I earn money in Switzerland, I spend in Switzerland. That is the honest way to go about it.
Make your mind up.
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Old 14.11.2011, 12:52
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Re: Coop caught selling old meat as new

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Make your mind up.
Mind is made up. I clearly state that I go to France for the product range and to buy product there that isn't available in Switzerland. Likewise, I don't buy meats etc there because the quality is not the same and that would hurt the Swiss farmers.

I support Switzerland by buying in Switzerland when i can. My gripe is with people that trot over the border every week to buy identical products in Germany that they can by here. I don't do that, therefore I am supporting the Swiss economy.

I don't think my position is all that hard to understand.
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Old 14.11.2011, 12:57
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Re: Coop caught selling old meat as new

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My gripe is with people that trot over the border every week to buy identical products in Germany that they can by here.
There are some plans to restrict that:

Proposal to reduce CHF 300 duty-free limit

even if one buys identical Swiss made products across the border that are even cheaper than here.

Shopping in Konstanz, Germany
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Old 14.11.2011, 13:04
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Re: Coop caught selling old meat as new

I expect that the type of folk that cause trouble in this area know where to cross the border without paying duties.

I understand the frustration of paying a crazy price for a product that costs so much less across the border but think the solution is much bigger than going over there myself to buy things. Ultimately, the duty needs to be abolished altogether but this would cause new nightmares/economic issues for many involved.

It isn't and easy problem to fix.

Of course, I am also guilty of getting angry about the difficulty involved in getting my hands on some items from outside of Switzerland. But again, these items tend to be the ones that you cannot buy here... not just ordered from Europe because they are cheaper.

It is an interesting move to suggest lowering the duty-free limit. That would cause a real uproar, no doubt. And the movement to more underground tactics.
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