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  #21  
Old 29.09.2007, 13:06
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Re: Euthanasia in Switzerland

The person who was very close to me chose to go with Exit, you don't see this one in the news so often. He'd been a member for at least 10 years.

It was a very strange situation, as the grieving process started from the day he informed us that on this date and time he was going to die. He didn't want to see us after that, i can only say that it was a long and mind- searching week, He didn't have an incurable or painful disease, he just slowly lost the ability to do many things he enjoyed and looking after himself was becoming more and more difficult.

On the morning of his death my husband and I sat on the terrace (he didn't want any of us to be there) with our eyes on our watches and at nine o'clock the phone call came. He went peacefully in his own bed after drinking a lethal cocktail.

After the initial shock i came to terms with his choice and even admired him for his courage. He was dignified and independent in life and thats how he stayed in death.

I hope no one looks at this as some kind of sob-story. From a philosophical view the whole experience got me thinking along a completely different track and i could imagine that this form of death could one day be an option that i would choose.

I think it's a shame that Dignitas has had so much bad press, some things could do with being changed, especially certain profit aspects, but on the whole people should have a choice.
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  #22  
Old 29.09.2007, 15:35
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Re: Euthanasia in Switzerland

I guess the whole discussion about Dignitas was not about the dying per se, but about the location - you just can't do that in a "normal" neighbourhood where everyone can see the coffins being brought out on an almost daily basis (guess they had quite a few requests at that time). Nobody would want that...from my point of view. I have no one (of this affected neighbourhood) heard mention that it is "unnatural" - so they would agree that a human being should have the choice to go when they feel it is right for them (in terms of diseases/loss of control over your life). However that is only my interpretation of what I've heard and seen on the news...
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  #23  
Old 29.09.2007, 20:15
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Re: Euthanasia in Switzerland

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I think it's a shame that Dignitas has had so much bad press, some things could do with being changed, especially certain profit aspects, but on the whole people should have a choice.
I thought that Dignitas was a non-profit organisation that relied on donations. You only pay for the drugs and the cremation costs. Is this not correct ?

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I guess the whole discussion about Dignitas was not about the dying per se, but about the location - you just can't do that in a "normal" neighbourhood where everyone can see the coffins being brought out on an almost daily basis (guess they had quite a few requests at that time).
I understand that they have left, or are about to leave, the location in Zurich. Obviously it would be nice if they could find some suitable place other than an apartment but I suppose it's a question of costs.
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  #24  
Old 30.09.2007, 13:23
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Re: Euthanasia in Switzerland

[quote=Blonaybear;110289]I thought that Dignitas was a non-profit organisation that relied on donations. You only pay for the drugs and the cremation costs. Is this not correct ?

You are correct BB but there was some speculation about the founder.http://www.kath.ch/pdf/kipa_20070730165628.pdf

Unfortunately I'm having problems accessing the Tagesanzieger archives so cant add the full article at the moment.
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Old 30.09.2007, 16:00
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Re: Euthanasia in Switzerland

Thanks for the article. I note it’s from the Catholic church which no boubt opposes assisted suicide. The founder, Ludwig Minelli, is a lawyer by profession so it is hardly surprising that he is worth 1.3 million francs.

Dignitas has dealt with about 450 people in 9 years, about 50 per year. This article says that each person pays CHF 7000 but it doesn’t mention that this includes the cost of undertakers and crematorium which probably account for most of it.

Here’s a couple of articles about Dignitas. Article 1. Article 2.
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  #26  
Old 04.10.2007, 13:12
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Re: Euthanasia in Switzerland

Story today on Swissinfo here.
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  #27  
Old 04.10.2007, 21:13
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Re: Euthanasia in Switzerland

As long as the decision is made by someone of sound mind then it their choice. Doctors sometimes try too hard to keep people alive, when my Grandmother was in hospital we had to fight with the doctor in charge of her care to get a DNR order for her. There was no way she was coming out of there alive so why prolong her obvious suffering?
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  #28  
Old 04.10.2007, 22:14
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Re: Euthanasia in Switzerland

The Swiss info story is interesting. I suppose that part of the problem is that physicians fear litigation if they assist in "active" measures - either suicide or euthanasia. I think it is also difficult for physicians, trained to treat diseases and "save lives" to change gears and let go. They're just as imperfect as the rest of us.

And while we might agree with the ideas behind Dignitas - or perhaps many of them - still most people wish to be as far removed from death as possible. We don't want to even think of it, or be reminded of it, it's an icky feeling (how's that for a scientific term).

I do hate that the media frames this as death tourism - it just fans the flames. There was an article in the Daily Mail earlier this year (yes, a truly *reputable* journal ..not) that described one woman's experience (from the perspective of her unhappy family) and likened it to "backoffice abortion." Of course, these images do nothing but sell papers and create negative emotions....

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  #29  
Old 04.10.2007, 22:43
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Re: Euthanasia in Switzerland

Quote:
The Swiss info story is interesting. I suppose that part of the problem is that physicians fear litigation if they assist in "active" measures - either suicide or euthanasia. I think it is also difficult for physicians, trained to treat diseases and "save lives" to change gears and let go. They're just as imperfect as the rest of us.

And while we might agree with the ideas behind Dignitas - or perhaps many of them - still most people wish to be as far removed from death as possible. We don't want to even think of it, or be reminded of it, it's an icky feeling (how's that for a scientific term).

I do hate that the media frames this as death tourism - it just fans the flames. There was an article in the Daily Mail earlier this year (yes, a truly *reputable* journal ..not) that described one woman's experience (from the perspective of her unhappy family) and likened it to "backoffice abortion." Of course, these images do nothing but sell papers and create negative emotions....

e.
The Times did an interview with the director and headed 'Switzerlands Dr Death"
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  #30  
Old 07.10.2007, 18:17
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Re: Euthanasia in Switzerland

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Polls show opinions differ over "death tourism"


Story from Swissinfo.
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  #31  
Old 07.10.2007, 22:52
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Re: Euthanasia in Switzerland

I couldn't get a clear sense of the survey from the article:

While only 46 per cent of the respondents in the German-speaking part came out against such a practice, a majority of 56 per cent in the French-speaking regions approved it.

46% came out against it in the German speaking part (which means that 54% were either for it or undecided/no opinion) and 56% in the French speaking part approved it (which means that 44% were undecided/no opinion or against it).

It might be a typo, or it might be a problem in translation or it might be that the writer does not know how to interpret survey results. It's totally uninformative though.

Suppose this was the question:
1. Do you approve of assisted suicide?
a Yes
b No

Then there would be no (significant) difference between the results. (e.g., approvals of 54% in the German speaking area and 56% in the French). I've not seen the survey, and I suspect there might have been degrees of agreement, or a no opinion/undecided measure. So lack of clarity could be derived from a typo, or a problem in translation or perhaps the writer does not know how to interpret survey results. And then there's always the possibility of an editor who decided to cut seemingly useless words.

Oh well.....

e.
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  #32  
Old 07.12.2007, 02:21
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Re: Euthanasia in Switzerland

I want my death rights god damit! I will decide when and how to end my life.
Even as a healthy person if I decide to end my life then no religious nut job or politician should dare to poke his tripod in my business.
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  #33  
Old 07.12.2007, 19:30
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Re: Euthanasia in Switzerland

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I am a member of VES in the UK and have a credit card sized advanced directive in my purse. I am seriously thinking of having a tattoo on my chest with do not resucitate written. My living will is with my GP in the UK and our solicitor, tragically my husband would do everything in his power to keep me alive which to my mind is tantamount to abuse. Having been a nurse for many years, I have seen the outcomes of resus and it is not always good. As far as death in other cultures is concerned, I think that westereners have a lot to learn from the Thais. Four or five day party, lots of music and drink and a jolly good way to send off the deceased, but, each to their own.
Not too sure about the tatoo idea myself. imagine how painful it would be having the small print put on And what a nuisance if you decide to change your stance! And what about if you decide to have a boob job in the years ahead and the doctor misinterprets the message on your chest

Far better to put your thoughts on a website and then have the tattoo refer to that website, so that any would-be resucitator has the opportunity to familiarise themselves with your very latest thoughts on the matter!

Generally I'm with the views already expressed on this thread...it ought to come down to personal choice. Sometimes I think the word "euthanasia" is sometimes mixed up with suicide (as well as with young people from another continent!) and suffers as a result. But I think it's retty easy to draw a distinction between the two.

Any doctors here? Would it be against the Hippocratic oath to conveniently ignore a patient you knew was seeking euthanasia?
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  #34  
Old 07.12.2007, 20:27
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Re: Euthanasia in Switzerland

There are so many for and against discusssions ahead on this subject. When the Government has the say whether you live or die, that will be the coming problem. Like when you are 65, oops past your sell by date.....
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  #35  
Old 09.12.2007, 15:39
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Re: Euthanasia in Switzerland

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There are so many for and against discusssions ahead on this subject. When the Government has the say whether you live or die, that will be the coming problem. Like when you are 65, oops past your sell by date.....
I think the biggest problem here is not where and when you die but who picks up the tab! Forgive me if i sound mercenary but there is a tab to pick up for the Gemeinde where these deaths occur.

Although the legal recognized place is in an industrial area of Schwerzenbach at the moment, it still costs the Gemiende about 3,000 francs every time someone chooses this path in their area. So i think it' needs a law that if someone comes from an outside country they should pay the administrative costs incurred.
Is this me in the corner? is this me being not bothered about who goes? Is this me giving up me religion? Nah, it's me being practical and not wanting to subsidize someones death thats never paid a penny to this country.
Cold but true.
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  #36  
Old 09.12.2007, 17:11
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Re: Euthanasia in Switzerland

Cold but true ...

... is an additional money-related aspect revealing the darker but regrettably very real side of human nature that tends to emerge when a potential inheritance melts away to pay extended-care bills or other medical expenses. The issue of assisted suicide is not as clear-cut as it is made out to be. The more widespread the phenomenon becomes, the more pressure the elderly may feel to pull the plug - or request that it be pulled (on their relatives' behalf).

There is no doubting the lack of dignity in being forced to continue living against one's will, if such an existence is genuinely subjectively felt not to be worth living - for whatever reason. The ethical problem lies in how to determine that the will to request assisted suicide is truly the patient's, and the patient's only.
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  #37  
Old 09.12.2007, 19:25
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Re: Euthanasia in Switzerland

Exactly Euthanasia just like Globalization opens a whole big can of worms.
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  #38  
Old 10.12.2007, 11:55
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Re: Euthanasia in Switzerland

Tim, I see your point about the small print being painful, but my idea was a largish DO NOT RESUSCITATE nothing else. As a fallback, I do have an SOS bracelet with the same information in it. The website is a good idea, but in an emergency situation would the crew/firm/doctors be arsed to log in and check? I doubt it.
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  #39  
Old 10.12.2007, 11:56
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Re: Euthanasia in Switzerland

There must be another more appealing analogy ?
dave

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Exactly Euthanasia just like Globalization opens a whole big can of worms.
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  #40  
Old 07.12.2011, 16:22
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Re: Euthanasia in Switzerland

A very touching article in Linkiesta on euthanasia.
Lucio Magri, an Italian journalist and politician, suffered from depression after his wife's death and did not see any point in living any longer. His death apparently sparked a huge debate in Italy with lots of condemnation and religious indignation. A question was raised whether depression can be treated as an incurable disease.
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