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Old 15.03.2012, 12:05
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Switzerland's upper house of parliament, the Council of States, decided on Wednesday by 21 votes to 19 to give same-sex couples the right to adopt children.

Read the full article: Swiss edge closer to gay adoption
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Old 13.12.2012, 22:11
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Re: Swiss edge closer to gay adoption

An update:

The Swiss parliament has voted to allow gay couples to adopt children. However, the motion passed in the House of Representatives on Thursday was not so liberal as the original version approved by the Senate.

The Senate had approved a motion granting adoption rights regardless of marital status or sexual orientation, as long as the arrangement was the best option for the child in question. However, the House of Representatives altered the motion – specifying that a homosexual could only adopt the child of his or her partner.

In Switzerland, gay couples in a registered partnership are not allowed to adopt children. However, Swiss law permits a single gay man or lesbian woman to do so. This peculiar situation – which essentially punishes couples who have made a formal legal commitment to each other – is what sparked gay rights’ groups to ask legislators to amend the law.

In Switzerland it is estimated that there are several thousand children growing up in homes headed by same-sex couples.

More

and also:

http://www.regenbogenfamilien.ch/
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Old 13.12.2012, 22:26
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Re: Swiss edge closer to gay adoption

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In Switzerland, gay couples in a registered partnership are not allowed to adopt children. However, Swiss law permits a single gay man or lesbian woman to do so. This peculiar situation – which essentially punishes couples who have made a formal legal commitment to each other – is what sparked gay rights’ groups to ask legislators to amend the law.
Sooo..ostensibly, one half of a gay couple adopts a child from, say, Ukraine, brings the child back to Switzerland, whereby the other half then formally adopts the child making the union and parenthood legit for everyone?

Sounds like a lot of paperwork. Which is very....Swiss.
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Old 22.03.2013, 21:44
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Re: Swiss edge closer to gay adoption

Adoption of a child in Ukraine, especially by a single(at least as it appears to be on the territory of Ukraine =)) male is already a lot of paperwork and not limited to paperwork itself, so legalizing such parental rights in Switzerland after achieved them in Ukraine will be just another bit of whole. And probably less than 1/3 of total.
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Old 22.03.2013, 22:11
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Re: Swiss edge closer to gay adoption

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Sooo..ostensibly, one half of a gay couple adopts a child from, say, Ukraine, brings the child back to Switzerland, whereby the other half then formally adopts the child making the union and parenthood legit for everyone?

Sounds like a lot of paperwork. Which is very....Swiss.
Lot of paperwork... very Swiss??? You should really try and live in other countries and do the comparison yourself.

Back to topic: Do you really think the law makers are that stupid? I won't tell you that I am a lawyer, but :

- single may adopt abroad
- gay partner may adopt partner's own child
hence gay partner may NOT adopt adopted child abroad.

The key? The definition of "partner's own child". A lawyer would help us, hence not me.
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Old 22.03.2013, 22:40
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Re: Swiss edge closer to gay adoption

becomes interesting... what is exactly the definition of "partner's own child"
what if one have real own child with DNA test proved paternity and his name on birth certificate of the child?

i'm aware that e.g. surrogacy is completely out of law in Switzerland and if any suspicion rise Swiss authorities may not grant a child to entry the country, but there were already precedents when such children were brought from Georgia for instance. And yes that was publicly criticized those days.
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Old 23.03.2013, 00:04
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Re: Swiss edge closer to gay adoption

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becomes interesting... what is exactly the definition of "partner's own child"
what if one have real own child with DNA test proved paternity and his name on birth certificate of the child?
"Partner's own child": Parents are the ones who are legally registred as parents. DNA doesn't have anything to do with it from a legal perspective.

Most important is really that now you can legally adopt your partners child. That covers most of the cases and is important, not for the parents but for the child. Adoption rights have to cover the childs need. Adopting is not a human right.

Granting adoption rights to gay couples is not urgent. Most gay couples don't want children so the number of affected people is really low.

In my opinion we should grant the rights to everyone who is able to afford and comfort a child. I guess this will take another 10 to 20 years in this country. But the whole thing is not as much of drama as some people want make you believe.
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Old 25.03.2013, 10:06
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Re: Swiss edge closer to gay adoption

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Granting adoption rights to gay couples is not urgent. Most gay couples don't want children so the number of affected people is really low.
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Old 25.03.2013, 10:48
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Re: Swiss edge closer to gay adoption

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Yes, please don't explain. Just put a fu****** smiley.
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Old 25.03.2013, 10:53
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Re: Swiss edge closer to gay adoption

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Yes, please don't explain. Just put a fu****** smiley.
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Old 25.03.2013, 13:10
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Re: Swiss edge closer to gay adoption

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Yes, please don't explain. Just put a fu****** smiley.
Unless you have some insights into the gay or adoption community that you're hiding from all of us, or that entire post is missing a footnote, I have no idea how you can say that adoption isn't 'urgent' or that gay couples don't want kids. I have a colleague who is actively looking for a transfer to Brussels because her IVF that her and her partner need (who she married to, but it's not recognized here) need isn't covered by their insurance because they are gay. That's only one example (and it's very distressing for them, as you can imagine), but part of the huge push for gay marriage is exactly to be able to get adoption, fertility treatments, insurance and inheritace (all 'family' privelleges) recognized. Waiting 10-20 years isn't really helpful, no matter how un-urgent you feel the situation is.
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Old 25.03.2013, 14:19
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Re: Swiss edge closer to gay adoption

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Unless you have some insights into the gay or adoption community that you're hiding from all of us, or that entire post is missing a footnote, I have no idea how you can say that adoption isn't 'urgent' or that gay couples don't want kids.
Because that was exactly the position of many gay organization in Switzerland during the process to legalize gay partnership. I myself only know gay couples who live with the child of their partner, all the others don't want kids. I just statet that MOST gay couples don't want children.

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I have a colleague who is actively looking for a transfer to Brussels because her IVF that her and her partner need (who she married to, but it's not recognized here) need isn't covered by their insurance because they are gay.
We are talking about adoption, not IVF.

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That's only one example (and it's very distressing for them, as you can imagine), but part of the huge push for gay marriage is exactly to be able to get adoption, fertility treatments, insurance and inheritace (all 'family' privelleges) recognized. Waiting 10-20 years isn't really helpful, no matter how un-urgent you feel the situation is.
As I mentioned before I would give all the rights to everyone right away. But we live in the real world. I don't know how long you followed the political discussions about this topic. Adoption was clearly excluded from the whole complex of gay partnership legalization because we have a strong conservative base here and would have risked to loose everything.

With the stepchild adoptation an important step was done. In fact this was done for the benefit of the kids not the parents.

If the whole thing was as dramatic the gay organization can try to setup a "Volksabstimmung". In the meantime it's pragmatism til society has changed to accept other forms of life. But as you have seen lately with the "Kinderkrippen"-Initiative sometimes it's hard to convince the people from the german speaking conservative part of Switzerland (excluding the cities).
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Old 25.03.2013, 14:25
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Re: Swiss edge closer to gay adoption

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all the others don't want kids.
I actually have no idea, but I can imagine that they don't tell just anybody about it.
Furthermore: the number of people concerned has nothing to do with rights and laws. One makes laws and give rights and define duties for everybody as a matter of principle, the number of people actually making use of the law is no concern of the law makers.
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Old 25.03.2013, 14:31
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Re: Swiss edge closer to gay adoption

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Furthermore: the number of people concerned has nothing to do with rights and laws. One makes laws and give rights and define duties for everybody as a matter of principle, the number of people actually making use of the law is no concern of the law makers.
How it should be and the political reality are two pair of shoes. I wish it would be like you describe.
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Old 25.03.2013, 14:34
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Re: Swiss edge closer to gay adoption

If your message above is to be understood as "There are far too few votes for a politician to be gained so that they don't care", then in deed, we totally agree. The perceived disagreement must be just a misunderstanding, no?
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Old 25.03.2013, 14:48
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Re: Swiss edge closer to gay adoption

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If your message above is to be understood as "There are far too few votes for a politician to be gained so that they don't care", then in deed, we totally agree. The perceived disagreement must be just a misunderstanding, no?
No, there are many politician who care about these rights. But in the process of legislation you will have to fight the opposition. First in the parliament and then probably amongst the eligible voters. You will go for what is possible and realistic in the moment. Stepchild adoption was not an alternative a few years ago, now it is and the law was set to cover it; pragmatism.
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Old 25.03.2013, 15:07
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Re: Swiss edge closer to gay adoption

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... I have a colleague who is actively looking for a transfer to Brussels because her IVF that her and her partner need (who she married to, but it's not recognized here) need isn't covered by their insurance because they are gay...
AFAIK, basic insurance here doesn't cover IVF regardless of whether you're gay or straight. Some of the add-on insurances might. I would think that's true in other countries as well, as IVF is considered optional and not medically necessary treatment. Would the insurance companies pay for IVF treatments for a single woman, no partner of either gender, if she wanted to conceive on her own? Again I don't think so.

But back to adoption, which is what this thread is about. I see no problem with a gay couple adopting, provided they meet all the same legal requirements as a straight couple.

@ prof - Are you sure that DNA doesn't enter into the equation? In the case of a separation of any couple that adopted, I can see the courts favoring the biological parent rather than the adoptive parent (again, regardless of whether it was a same-sex couple or not).
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Old 25.03.2013, 15:15
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Re: Swiss edge closer to gay adoption

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@ prof - Are you sure that DNA doesn't enter into the equation? In the case of a separation of any couple that adopted, I can see the courts favoring the biological parent rather than the adoptive parent (again, regardless of whether it was a same-sex couple or not).
Yes, for custody/parental care.When you separate you are still a legal parent.
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Old 25.03.2013, 15:27
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Re: Swiss edge closer to gay adoption

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AFAIK, basic insurance here doesn't cover IVF regardless of whether you're gay or straight. Some of the add-on insurances might. I would think that's true in other countries as well, as IVF is considered optional and not medically necessary treatment. Would the insurance companies pay for IVF treatments for a single woman, no partner of either gender, if she wanted to conceive on her own? Again I don't think so.
To clarify: One had uterine cancer and had her eggs frozen and that's what they want to use for the treatment. But getting her partner pregnant with them is being refused on the gounds that they are gay. Yes, it's not medically necessary, but getting pregnant isn't a 'right' either. My neighbour is a single mom who decided to go at it alone and her IUI was covered with donor sperm.

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Because that was exactly the position of many gay organization in Switzerland during the process to legalize gay partnership. I myself only know gay couples who live with the child of their partner, all the others don't want kids. I just statet that MOST gay couples don't want children.
Can you send me links?
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Old 25.03.2013, 15:31
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Re: Swiss edge closer to gay adoption

I've got a problem with all this stuff.

I don't necessarily want to adopt a gay. I don't have any space for pets either.
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