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  #41  
Old 14.04.2012, 15:12
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Re: Cross-border shoppers targeted by campaign

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The real point is that COOP and Migros are complaining about customers going to Euro countries to buy when they are doing exactly the same and then marking up the prices by 20-30% and wondering why customers are behaving the way they are.

The customers can see straight through their hyprocrisy and know that COOP and Migros are only protecting the agricultural industry. Its just a Cartel with COOP, Migros and the agricultural industry joined together to look after their own bank accounts.
The fixed costs have not fallen over the time, & the cost to sell the goods is often more than the price of the goods in many cases.
CoOp & Migros pay more for many goods as they entered into long term agreements, they can't buy from German wholesalers like Aldi & Lidl. Just like fixing interest rates on a mortgage 5 years ago, it seemed like a good idea at the time!

I don't think most people's salaries in CH have fallen 30% over the last 5 years either!
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  #42  
Old 14.04.2012, 15:20
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Re: Cross-border shoppers targeted by campaign

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Or 31st October 2007 1.6762 to 11 Aug 2011 1.0499 approx 37%.
Of course in October 2007 shopping was not cheaper in Germany, in many cases more expensive!

In 2007 there was still a big advantage shopping in Germany, admitted it was not all goods but on most grocery shopping we did we usually saved the same amount we spent when compared to the Swiss prices. So if we spent 50Euros that was usually about that much cheaper then what was possible in Migros or CoOp in 2007
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  #43  
Old 14.04.2012, 15:30
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Re: Cross-border shoppers targeted by campaign

That's absolute nonsense. Who told you this fairytale??

The Swiss pricing is not as much of a ripoff, as it is a result of inefficiencies and old fashioned practices. For a Swiss retailer, to generate 1 CHF of revenue, they need to sell 100CHF worth if goods. In other words, 99% of a price you see at stores is simply to cover costs. However, if you look at the company structures and the way business is done along with all sort of "political" influences, then you will understand why they only generate so little revenue.
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  #44  
Old 14.04.2012, 15:39
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Re: Cross-border shoppers targeted by campaign

It don't say squat about what and how stockpiling is being implemented in the sales price of products.
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  #45  
Old 14.04.2012, 15:53
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Re: Cross-border shoppers targeted by campaign

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The customers can see straight through their hyprocrisy and know that COOP and Migros are only protecting the agricultural industry. Its just a Cartel with COOP, Migros and the agricultural industry joined together to look after their own bank accounts.
I have to partly disagree, from what my farmer friend tells me (and from the stories I've about the fate of small businesses who end up with a big retailer as their largest client) it would seem that big retailers also do to the farmer what they do best - squeeze until the pips squeak!
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  #46  
Old 14.04.2012, 16:06
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Re: Cross-border shoppers targeted by campaign

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The Swiss pricing is not as much of a ripoff, as it is a result of inefficiencies and old fashioned practices...
An intriguing statement, old fashioned practices I can see happening in smaller shops and businesses, but certainly not the big retailers. No matter what the external face of the company (closing at lunch, limited Saturday hours, etc...) internally I would say that they are VERY up to date AND efficient otherwise how could they end up dominating the Swiss retail Market. nor does it explain how the same "old fashioned and inefficient" companies (to paraphrase your wording) manage to own and run cross border branches where the same goods cost less than in CH.

Smaller companies, however, are a different matter. Some I've experienced have been efficient with Swiss watch precision, others couldn't find their own a**e with both hands and a large scale map...
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  #47  
Old 14.04.2012, 16:12
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Re: Cross-border shoppers targeted by campaign

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In 2007 there was still a big advantage shopping in Germany, admitted it was not all goods but on most grocery shopping we did we usually saved the same amount we spent when compared to the Swiss prices. So if we spent 50Euros that was usually about that much cheaper then what was possible in Migros or CoOp in 2007
Strange, My GF at the time lived in Basel & we stopped general food shopping in DE as it was in many cases more expensive.
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  #48  
Old 14.04.2012, 16:13
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Re: Cross-border shoppers targeted by campaign

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An intriguing statement, old fashioned practices I can see happening in smaller shops and businesses, but certainly not the big retailers. No matter what the external face of the company (closing at lunch, limited Saturday hours, etc...) internally I would say that they are VERY up to date AND efficient otherwise how could they end up dominating the Swiss retail Market. nor does it explain how the same "old fashioned and inefficient" companies (to paraphrase your wording) manage to own and run cross border branches where the same goods cost less than in CH.

Smaller companies, however, are a different matter. Some I've experienced have been efficient with Swiss watch precision, others couldn't find their own a**e with both hands and a large scale map...
Would you like some examples?
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  #49  
Old 14.04.2012, 16:21
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Re: Cross-border shoppers targeted by campaign

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Would you like some examples?
Hmm, are you perhaps not confusing old fashioned and inefficient with good old incompetence - a very popular item I am led to believe and one i understand is practiced world-wide and even in the top Fortune 100 companies..
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  #50  
Old 14.04.2012, 16:23
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Re: Cross-border shoppers targeted by campaign

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Hmm, are you perhaps not confusing old fashioned and inefficient with good old incompetence - a very popular item I am led to believe and one i understand is practiced world-wide and even in the top Fortune 100 companies..
Possibly so however, Swiss retailers take it to a whole other level.
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  #51  
Old 14.04.2012, 18:52
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Re: Cross-border shoppers targeted by campaign

I have quite a bit of experience working with various operators in the fields of logistics, distribution, and retail throughout Switzerland.

With a few exceptions, most players are uncomfortable with and not well adapted to the concept of competition, and the inefficiencies and plain incompetence at every level is shocking from the perspective of an outsider.

The knee-jerk reaction is to control markets vertically, maintain margins at any cost, and keep out competition by restricting access to markets. Rarely is the idea of improving customer service, increasing choice, or increasing efficiency using modern methods of market research, tracking sales, targeted advertising, etc. even considered, never mind implemented. Most people in the industry are simply not accustomed to having to move with the times and actually compete for new clients, markets, nor are they accustomed to seeing off competition from outside the country and those few within that look outwards for examples, or that have come from outside with new ideas. Many are simply too lazy and complacent to even try.

The sad fact is that without working very hard many companies have been able to flourish in spite of ancient business practices, generally incompetent sales, marketing, and innovation departments, and clueless owners. The Swiss tend to be the least price sensitive consumers in all of Europe, yet the dominant players like Coop and Migros still have the nerve to blame them for going abroad in the face of the contempt they show their customers.

Prices have barely moved since the Swiss Franc has gained massively in value against the Euro, and this in times of so-called consumer belt-tightening, and economic downturn. Someone is making a lot of money and it isn't the farmers, that's for sure.

It's not all as simple as i might be portraying it, and as a small country with language particularities, high standards and high income, a lot of leeway can be given in explaining the high price of virtually everything, but it doesn't change the essential fact that most Swiss residents are allowing themselves to be ripped off, and in view of what I know, I have absolutely no moral compunction in buying from abroad.

I do use local tradesmen, buy a lot of my meat from local farmers, and proudly buy many Swiss products when I can, but many items produced outside of this country are simply massively overpriced by any measure.
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  #52  
Old 14.04.2012, 18:59
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Re: Cross-border shoppers targeted by campaign

About "imported food is subject to a tax that maintains Swiss food stockpiles in the event that things ever turn hairy"

I do not quite understand? So you mean the Swiss only stockpile imported food?

Anyway the taxes are pretty low; mostly around 4CHF per kilo - not enough to explain the high prices?
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  #53  
Old 14.04.2012, 19:44
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Re: Cross-border shoppers targeted by campaign

Aww, poor ickle Migros.


Maybe the manager of their Altstetten store could have read this letter out today whilst standing next to the big pile of Mexican asparagus that they were still flogging at 8- for 500g, even though it was so limp, tired & lifeless that you could bend a piece into a full circle & it still didn't snap.
Or he could have read it standing next to the 4 boxes of liquid avacados that his store staff were blissfully ignoring & continuing to flog at 1.80 a pop.

What's that famous German word?... oh yes, 'schadenfreude'.
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  #54  
Old 14.04.2012, 20:01
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Re: Cross-border shoppers targeted by campaign

I just came back from shopping at the Geant in St. Louis today.

To be honest, the prices were not THAT much different than Switzerland. Add the cost of the train ticket and the fact that my shopping trip door to door cost me 6 hours (I used public transport)....and then you start to think seriously about whether you get any "real" savings when shopping abroad....

HOWEVER....

I will keep going to the Geant again and again and again even if it works out that I have to pay a higher price than shopping at Migros in Switzerland. The reason is this:

At the Geant: at least 20 (yes, 20! I counted them) different varieties and scents of soap.

At the Migros: only 2, unscented.

A girl likes a perfumed bath, since showering and personal grooming should be an experience to be enjoyed. (Not to mention at Geant: 6 different brands of tomato puree...at Migros....only 1. At Geant: 7 or 8 different brands of beer....at Migros: 0. At Geant: 30 different varieties of fish, frozen and fresh....at Migros.....um......fish? What's that? Oh, yeah, they have smoked trout, sometimes).

I gladly will pay a premium for variety, scent, flavour and COLOR! (I could tell I crossed the border when immediately I spotted a girl walking down the street wearing blue skinny pants, and a colorful, yellow, blue and red flower-print blouse. Looking behind me everyone else was wearing grey...).

So...Migros and Coop....take note.....
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  #55  
Old 14.04.2012, 20:15
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Re: Cross-border shoppers targeted by campaign

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Would you like some examples?
Yes, please. I'm curious.
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  #56  
Old 14.04.2012, 20:20
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Re: Cross-border shoppers targeted by campaign

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I laugh in their general direction. Poor Migros and Coop 30+% margin suffering a bit? Too bad. They can start by paying their staff better and then bring the prices down to about the EU levels.
Don't you think there is a bit of a contradiction here. It is partly because staff are paid much better than in surrounding Europe that prices are higher.
Because we live right on the French border and live on a UK pensions, we often shop in France (apart from doing like Olygirl, use our really friendly local shop) - and I can assure you the staff would kill to be able to get a job in Switzerland, with the much higher salaries and much better work conditions. The Aldi, Lidl and Dia supermarkets in our nearby French town look really dirty and messy, compared to the Swiss shops, and the staff are under huge pressure to work faster - so much so that they practically throw food at you at the till- and often apologize, explaining that they have to do so, lest they lose their job. Migros has always had an educational role, and subsidies 10000s of day and evening courses all over CH, btw. I can assure you that Tesco, Asda, etc, staff in the UK, and Wallmart, etc, in US too. At least the Swiss staff don't have to work nights and week-ends!

Must say that the staff at our local Migros and Coop are really friendly, always, greetings, help and smiles.


They are definitely doing a lot more checks at the border- including the bus passengers. Bought myself a bargain yesterday in France - a 2 kg NZ leg of lamb for 17Euros - Hurrah-
Got to the border and they were checking all cars - so just had to declare - 1 kg over our limit (2 of us in the car) and CHF 20 tax to pay - not so much of a bargain anymore! So if you have to drive a long way to do abroad shopping, with wear and tear/mileage + petrol- does it really make sense?
Remember that the max per person is 500gr of fresh meat only and 4.5kg poultry or cured meats and 300CHF per person in total.


Many Swiss do shop abroad too - but not many of them ask if you can survive on less than 120.000 chuffs per year!!

Last edited by Odile; 15.04.2012 at 12:31.
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  #57  
Old 14.04.2012, 20:23
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Re: Cross-border shoppers targeted by campaign

The cost of the compulsory stockpiles is very small in relation to the actual product price. Read the first link you posted: E.g. the additional cost for stockpiling gasoline is less than 0.5 cents per liter.
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Old 14.04.2012, 20:28
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Re: Cross-border shoppers targeted by campaign

I do not on a car but yes i do shop in France Saint Louis and Germany
Konstanz because i find nice products,cheaper check the price of the Meat
its like 35 Euros for a kilo of Beef Filet so the meat is more then 50% cheaper also i can speak French so it s convenient and i love to go to Alsace.
I also buy medicine over the counter,i am not Mrs Trump and can t afford to throw money by the window.
And i will get a lunch there and it s a nice day,of course it is a long day by train but all good things come with some effort.
I do find all the linens very nicely priced in Germany mostly at Gerber and Kalstadt when they have sale.
I bought myself a dress at Karlstadt from Esprit 69 Euros and on top of that i got the Vat back,it was 139 chf in Switzerland.
I do not think that Switzerland pay so much more the sale associates,as if you put the cost of living at the end of the day anywhere you live if you have a low salary it s hard.
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Old 14.04.2012, 20:33
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Re: Cross-border shoppers targeted by campaign

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Prices have barely moved since the Swiss Franc has gained massively in value against the Euro, and this in times of so-called consumer belt-tightening, and economic downturn. Someone is making a lot of money and it isn't the farmers, that's for sure.
Prices really don't move very much at all in CH. Many prices are unchanged or within 10% of 20 years ago. It's pretty much the same with salaries, at the moment the CHF is strong, 10 year ago to the day 1$ bought CHF 1.67.

Funny thing in the UK the £ has crashed over the last 5 years, have imported cars increased in the same proportion? No the margins have collapsed.
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Old 14.04.2012, 20:55
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Re: Cross-border shoppers targeted by campaign

Why is it that most of the foreigners who come to Switzerland ALWAYS bitch about how things are so expensive. Always whining .. If things were so good at home why did you not stay at home. I am a foreigner Canadian.. and I am married to a Swiss. I can always return home or to the USA if I so desired . There are many things that I do not like but I live with it. The grass is always greener on the other side. Most of the foreigners enjoy a much better lifestyle that that at home. So I say again if it is so hard for you and you do not like it here pack your bloody bags and go home. I am totally fed up of your whining and carrying on about everything , and in the meantime you are the very ones that do your utmost to exploit the system. Lets bring it on now..
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