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Old 13.07.2012, 09:49
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Re: US tourist killed in rail tunnel

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They possibly are scared out of the woods by people scaring them about dangerous people in the woods. And lured by the pleasures of indoors and of shopping-centers or in fear their "antique" people were too close on the fitness trail

It used to be like this in the 60ies in suburban Zürich
Tempi passati! In the old days you could tie up a frîend at a tree in the woods while playing Indian and Cowboys and completly forget about him until four hours later his father rang the door bell and asked where his son was. When getting the answer he stayed cool and told us to finish dinner before getting his son . The punishment was remarkably mild as well. A perfect end of a perfect day.
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  #162  
Old 13.07.2012, 18:23
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Re: US tourist killed in rail tunnel

Thank you, to some, for stating the obvious. I have been reading this thread and hear a lot of American bashing and that the kids were stupid or had no common sense. First of all, these were not stupid kids. Not by a long shot. This young woman had a brilliant future ahead of her. However, the key word there is YOUNG!!

I don't know how old the people are that participate in this forum, but I can tell you that young people think that they are invincible. It doesn't enter their minds that life can be changed in the blink of an eye. They were young, vibrant, alive and backpacking through Europe on an adventure of a lifetime! And she made an ill-fated step which cost her life. It has nothing to do with her being an American.

I just don't get the attitude here. A mother and father lost a child. A CHILD! How many of you have lost children? I pray none. And I pray that you will never experience that pain.

You do understand, don't you, that in search for answers, any information, the family is searching the internet and finding this forum. They are reading the sometimes ugly things that are being said.

I only hope that they can chalk it up to stupidity and lack of common sense.
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Old 13.07.2012, 18:32
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Re: US tourist killed in rail tunnel

What you say makes perfect sense and I agree with you but your username is a bit too for me.
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  #164  
Old 13.07.2012, 18:32
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Re: US tourist killed in rail tunnel

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Thank you, to some, for stating the obvious. I have been reading this thread and hear a lot of American bashing and that the kids were stupid or had no common sense. First of all, these were not stupid kids. Not by a long shot. This young woman had a brilliant future ahead of her. However, the key word there is YOUNG!!

I don't know how old the people are that participate in this forum, but I can tell you that young people think that they are invincible. It doesn't enter their minds that life can be changed in the blink of an eye. They were young, vibrant, alive and backpacking through Europe on an adventure of a lifetime! And she made an ill-fated step which cost her life. It has nothing to do with her being an American.

I just don't get the attitude here. A mother and father lost a child. A CHILD! How many of you have lost children? I pray none. And I pray that you will never experience that pain.

You do understand, don't you, that in search for answers, any information, the family is searching the internet and finding this forum. They are reading the sometimes ugly things that are being said.

I only hope that they can chalk it up to stupidity and lack of common sense.
This is very true, and I believe all feel for the family and friends of this tragedy for what it is: a tragedy.

One must also grasp that this is an open internet forum with thousands of users from many backgrounds. The purpose of such a forum is discussion, and many times the discussion is deep and painful and hits home for many, but this must not be a limit to the discussion. It is not the first time a discussion topic has unintentionally hit home, but when it happens, it sucks. There are threads here which I avoid because they hit home for me, and its disappointing for myself to be left out.

In the end, try to ignore the statements which might offend and take in the ones of support and sympathy, both are valid and necessary for open discussion and dialogue.
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  #165  
Old 13.07.2012, 19:46
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Re: US tourist killed in rail tunnel

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What you say makes perfect sense and I agree with you but your username is a bit too for me.

Sorry you find my username offensive. It is what it is.
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  #166  
Old 13.07.2012, 19:47
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Re: US tourist killed in rail tunnel

Thankfully, we survive most of the stupid things we do as children/young adults. And sometimes, we tell the adventure stories for years and years.

In this case, things worked out tragically. And while some of the American/English/Swiss bashing threads are amusing, it is probably not too appropriate on this one. And really, if you feel this incident had anything to do with nationality... I feel sorry for you.

fduvall

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Thank you, to some, for stating the obvious. I have been reading this thread and hear a lot of American bashing and that the kids were stupid or had no common sense. First of all, these were not stupid kids. Not by a long shot. This young woman had a brilliant future ahead of her. However, the key word there is YOUNG!!

I don't know how old the people are that participate in this forum, but I can tell you that young people think that they are invincible. It doesn't enter their minds that life can be changed in the blink of an eye. They were young, vibrant, alive and backpacking through Europe on an adventure of a lifetime! And she made an ill-fated step which cost her life. It has nothing to do with her being an American.

I just don't get the attitude here. A mother and father lost a child. A CHILD! How many of you have lost children? I pray none. And I pray that you will never experience that pain.

You do understand, don't you, that in search for answers, any information, the family is searching the internet and finding this forum. They are reading the sometimes ugly things that are being said.

I only hope that they can chalk it up to stupidity and lack of common sense.
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  #167  
Old 13.07.2012, 19:49
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Re: US tourist killed in rail tunnel

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This is very true, and I believe all feel for the family and friends of this tragedy for what it is: a tragedy.

One must also grasp that this is an open internet forum with thousands of users from many backgrounds. The purpose of such a forum is discussion, and many times the discussion is deep and painful and hits home for many, but this must not be a limit to the discussion. It is not the first time a discussion topic has unintentionally hit home, but when it happens, it sucks. There are threads here which I avoid because they hit home for me, and its disappointing for myself to be left out.

In the end, try to ignore the statements which might offend and take in the ones of support and sympathy, both are valid and necessary for open discussion and dialogue.

I understand what you are saying, but because I know this family, I naturally take these statements to heart more than a casual observer. However, I feel that it has nothing to do with open discussion, but more to decent behavior and respect. Some of the comments here are downright cruel.
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  #168  
Old 13.07.2012, 20:01
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Re: US tourist killed in rail tunnel

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I understand what you are saying, but because I know this family, I naturally take these statements to heart more than a casual observer. However, I feel that it has nothing to do with open discussion, but more to decent behavior and respect. Some of the comments here are downright cruel.
First of all I would like to express my deepest condolences to the family that lost such a young life. I'm not that older than the victim and I lost couple of friends due to different circumstances that were around her age and all I can say is that it is overwhelming to deal with.

Second, I find it very true that some of the comments might have been "offensive" for the family of the girl but I can assure you that they were generic and not point towards the victim or any of her family. This is a forum where less or more sensitive matters are on discussion every day and people can be very open or blunt because they are not really connected with the case and they could never imagine that a relative or a friend would join the forum to read their posts.

The overall atmosphere here on this forum can be concentrated on bashing, mocking, making fun of certain events, nationalities, people, politicians..English speaking people who live in Switzerland find this forum as a vent of their everyday life or boring office work... So you won't find the deepest and smartest opinions out there!

But I don't agree with you that this has to do with decent behavior and respect. I'm pretty sure all of the members who posted were very very sorry for the loss of life (who wouldn't be) but they fell free to say their mind about the event...
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  #169  
Old 13.07.2012, 20:09
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Re: US tourist killed in rail tunnel

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First of all I would like to express my deepest condolences to the family that lost such a young life. I'm not that older than the victim and I lost couple of friends due to different circumstances that were around her age and all I can say is that it is overwhelming to deal with.

Second, I find it very true that some of the comments might have been "offensive" for the family of the girl but I can assure you that they were generic and not point towards the victim or any of her family. This is a forum where less or more sensitive matters are on discussion every day and people can be very open or blunt because they are not really connected with the case and they could never imagine that a relative or a friend would join the forum to read their posts.

The overall atmosphere here on this forum can be concentrated on bashing, mocking, making fun of certain events, nationalities, people, politicians..English speaking people who live in Switzerland find this forum as a vent of their everyday life or boring office work... So you won't find the deepest and smartest opinions out there!

But I don't agree with you that this has to do with decent behavior and respect. I'm pretty sure all of the members who posted were very very sorry for the loss of life (who wouldn't be) but they fell free to say their mind about the event...

I understand what you are saying and appreciate your kind words. Unfortunately, when you lose someone so far from home, it is difficult to get news of any sort, so they searched the internet and found this. And I am sure that you are right in that no one finds the lose of this young woman to be anything but tragic. Thank you for your comments.
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  #170  
Old 13.07.2012, 20:48
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Re: US tourist killed in rail tunnel

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Odile, you use the word kid - how old is that, in your view?
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Anyone under 40?
Under 50, I think. (ahem).
Isn't Zuriyogini a wiseman living in Basel (i.e. one who's moved from Zürich?)

The reason why it seems that this kind of stuff is always happening to American tourists is probably simply because there are so many of them. Proportionally, the level of stupidity and naivity is probably the same. Except for British tourists of course. Frankly, I'm surprised, being so stodgy, old (dethroned) colonialist racist, sexist, anti-semetic cold hearted meanies,that they're allowed across the channel (or the sea).
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  #171  
Old 13.07.2012, 20:51
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Re: US tourist killed in rail tunnel

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The reason why it seems that this kind of stuff is always happening to American tourists is probably simply because there are so many of them.
Agreed...


this short message is too
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  #172  
Old 13.07.2012, 22:56
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Re: US tourist killed in rail tunnel

@Zuriyogini... please do start another thread if you are unhappy with something(s).

This thread is NOT the appropriate place for for your anger/grievances to be expressed. Please take it to another thread.

fduvall

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Why don't you stop trolling this thread and have some decent respect for all and start your one bitching thread?
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  #173  
Old 13.07.2012, 23:07
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Re: US tourist killed in rail tunnel

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Zurich
Yogini-one who practices yoga, it's Sanskrit, I thought Americans weren't multilingual?
Like most Brits, they're usually barely monolingual. But apparently this particular one has a lack of irony sensitivity.

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No one is stupid or naive for dying!
Maybe so, but stupidity and/or naivity, however, are a cause of accidental death.

HTH, BIDI
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Old 14.07.2012, 13:53
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Re: US tourist killed in rail tunnel

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Like most Brits, they're usually barely monolingual. But apparently this particular one has a lack of irony sensitivity.



Maybe so, but stupidity and/or naivity, however, are a cause of accidental death.

HTH, BIDI
Right you are ! BUT if you look into silly accidents you see that very intelligent and highly educated and experienced people have MORE accidents than others. So that your theory does not hold water
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Old 15.07.2012, 04:53
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Re: US tourist killed in rail tunnel

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Totally agree, I think it is dumber that there aren't any signs of that entrance for pedestrians is blocked
Do I understand you correctly that there is no warning sign at ALL, even in German?
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Old 15.07.2012, 05:27
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Re: US tourist killed in rail tunnel

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Thank you, to some, for stating the obvious. I have been reading this thread and hear a lot of American bashing and that the kids were stupid or had no common sense. First of all, these were not stupid kids. Not by a long shot. This young woman had a brilliant future ahead of her. However, the key word there is YOUNG!!

I don't know how old the people are that participate in this forum, but I can tell you that young people think that they are invincible. It doesn't enter their minds that life can be changed in the blink of an eye. They were young, vibrant, alive and backpacking through Europe on an adventure of a lifetime! And she made an ill-fated step which cost her life. It has nothing to do with her being an American.

I just don't get the attitude here. A mother and father lost a child. A CHILD! How many of you have lost children? I pray none. And I pray that you will never experience that pain.

You do understand, don't you, that in search for answers, any information, the family is searching the internet and finding this forum. They are reading the sometimes ugly things that are being said.

I only hope that they can chalk it up to stupidity and lack of common sense.
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I understand what you are saying, but because I know this family, I naturally take these statements to heart more than a casual observer. However, I feel that it has nothing to do with open discussion, but more to decent behavior and respect. Some of the comments here are downright cruel.
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I understand what you are saying and appreciate your kind words. Unfortunately, when you lose someone so far from home, it is difficult to get news of any sort, so they searched the internet and found this. And I am sure that you are right in that no one finds the lose of this young woman to be anything but tragic. Thank you for your comments.
Thank you, that is exactly how I found this forum, searching for information
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Old 15.07.2012, 16:46
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Re: US tourist killed in rail tunnel

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Do I understand you correctly that there is no warning sign at ALL, even in German?

They look as follows






What else ? I think that this is clear enough

Last edited by Wollishofener; 15.07.2012 at 16:57.
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  #178  
Old 15.07.2012, 18:12
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Re: US tourist killed in rail tunnel

Wolli, you're absolutely right. Looking at the picture, it's fairly obvious why they felt no sign was necessary.
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Old 15.07.2012, 18:33
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Re: US tourist killed in rail tunnel

I have quite a bit of sympathy for the parents...And for the kids, to a point...

What I am going to say is absolutely ugly, but don't be surprised if this gets fast tracked to the Darwin awards. I hope that is not the case, because I don't like death and suffering being mocked, but you should prepare for it.
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Old 15.07.2012, 18:44
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Re: US tourist killed in rail tunnel

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I have quite a bit of sympathy for the parents, I just really have a hard time feeling sympathy for the kids in this case.

What I am going to say is absolutely ugly, but don't be surprised if this gets fast tracked to the Darwin awards.
I've been thinking more and more about the poor girl that lost her life and the "Darwin award" comments, which are fair BUT

I really think this could have happened to anybody. I imagine myself doing a hike with friend on a bright sunny day getting trapped in front of a tunnel that I see the other end of it, not only I will be tempted to pass it but seeing the surroundings and being able to see any train activity and react on time - I will do it and feel comfortable about it.

Do I think passing through train tunnels is safe? No. Is it smart? No. Can it be done? Yes. What are the chances of a tragedy like this? 1 in a million? Perhaps.

I don't think these 4 friends are the only ones passing through the tunnels in Switzerland. 3 of them passed to safety, only one slipped and fell on the track (from the friend's post here on EF). As far as I know, there are holes along side the tunnel for you to hide when a train is passing, I don't know if such holes were present at this particular tunnel?

I see this tragedy as any other transport related tragedy. You see both sides of the street and cross it even if there is no zebra but you check for cars, there are none, you go. Sometimes you speed on the highway with or without realizing, things might happen. It's just normal and sometimes happens and some people are not lucky enough on that particular day on that particular moment.

Anyhow, she didn't deserve it and what she did is in no way worse than the things we do on daily basis that involve risk, no matter how stupid the "entered train tunnel" expression looks like.
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