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  #21  
Old 22.12.2012, 00:43
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Re: more than 8 014 000 people

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Apart from the inhabitants of Estavayer-le-Lac who won't be happy to be 'au lac' LOL Now, what are you going to put in the Val-de-Travers? Green fairies?
the VAT-administration
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  #22  
Old 22.12.2012, 08:18
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Re: more than 8 014 000 people

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How many more can we let in?
They let you in
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  #23  
Old 22.12.2012, 10:39
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Re: more than 8 014 000 people

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Australia is almost empty since they have all moved here
And half the UK has settled down in the La Cote area. Too much? Too little integration? It puts me upsise down to see Brits in Nyon buying their UK newspaper talking to the clerk exclusively in english
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  #24  
Old 22.12.2012, 10:51
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Re: more than 8 014 000 people

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I think a greater population hold many benefits. The main issue for me is, that the infrastructure is not updated according to the higher influx of people, which strains the quality of life considerably.
If "updated infrastructure" means more ugly concrete all over the place, cloned from the circa three different types of building the Swiss architects can do, then i'd prefer to go without those "improvements".
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  #25  
Old 22.12.2012, 11:22
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It is just a problem of "distribution". If the following changes would be forced through
- HQ of UBS to Sumiswald
- HQ of CS to Flims
- the Federal Foreign Ministry to Appenzell
- the Federal Interior Ministry to Airolo
- the Federal Traffic etc Ministry to Langenthal
- the HQ of Hoffroche to Gettnau/LU
- the HQ of Novartis to Sachseln
- the Federal Finance Ministry to Savognin
- the HQ of Nestle to Brig
- the HQ of the Swiss Federal Bank to Göschenen
- the HQ of ABB to Affoltern am Albis
- the Federal Ministry of Economy up to Ziegelbrücke
- Bührle Immobilien to Wald/ZH
- the Federal Justice Ministry to Mendrisio
- the Federal Defence Ministry to Estavayer-au-Lac
costs will come down and everybody will be happy
Hopefully all this would go smoother than moving the Statistical Office to Neuchatel a couple of years ago... or Switzerland will be in a bad way.

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Switzerland will soon hit the 10m mark if the Federal Council doesn't invoke the safeguard clause with respect to southern European countries (France, Spain, Portugal...).

Check this link (French).
Is that a bit of French-baiting going on? Too easy.
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  #26  
Old 22.12.2012, 11:55
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Re: more than 8 014 000 people

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Switzerland will soon hit the 10m mark if the Federal Council doesn't invoke the safeguard clause with respect to southern European countries (France, Spain, Portugal...).

Check this link (French).
You ought to bear in mind TWO aspects. First of all, Switzerland in the past few years nicely succeeded to get a fairly qualified or even most highly qualified sort of newcomers. Second, Switzerland confronted by the growing wave of retirement of the Babyboomer-generation and only partially replaced by the far "smaller" anti-baby-pill generation NEEDS a certain immigration.

The restrictions against immigration already now are stiff. BUT when you go into retirement, you are NOT to die away, not even to book a grave. So that the population as such may grow to 9 or 10 mio., but then start to stabilize in between 15 and 30 years, when the aforementioned retirees will gradually fade away.

Alright, the banking-industry did, does + will get down in importance in a way, which will mean that it no longer will be in the same position as it was some 5 years ago. Which means that a certain number of ambitious expats may leave to more "promising" places.

BUT, look at families who immigrated from the Med in the 1980ies 90ies and 00ies. They, quite unlike the "natives" tend to have children. THIS is the REAL source of the population growth. AND, the Secondos are educated here and look for more square meters of logdings than their parents ever did.

What is a problem in/for Switzerland, to a similar extent is a problem in/for Europe and that is that Europe is unable to absorb two billions of immigrants from the continents of Africa and Asia. There not only is a balance to be maintained somehow, but, far more important, Europe has to help those continents to develop in a way that emigrants from Europe, Australia and the USA will flock to the booming economies of Mocambique, Angola, Congo, Cameroon, Ghana, Ivory Coast, Nigeria, Tanzania, Kenya, Uganda and SouthSudan
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  #27  
Old 22.12.2012, 12:03
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Re: more than 8 014 000 people

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Switzerland is almost full. We are more than 8 million now....
Switzerland isn't as crowded as many other European countries based on its overall area. http://chartsbin.com/view/e1r

If you took away the uninhabitable mountain and lake areas I think that it would show that it is possibly one of the more crowded countries.

Large areas of Switzerland are sparsely populated as the majority of the population is concentrated around the six main urban areas: Geneva, Lausanne, Bern, Basel, Zurich and Winterthur. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Di...a_svizzera.png
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  #28  
Old 22.12.2012, 12:08
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Re: more than 8 014 000 people

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Whenever data about immigration, number of inhabitants, population's density and stuff like this is publicly discussed,

it sounds that Switzerland's growth would somehow be unique.

Fact is that it is not.


Most European countries have similar growing rates (or had even a stronger one), at least until 10 years ago absolutely proportional to Swiss numbers.

One big exception is France that by 1860 was the outstandingly biggest country in the "civilized" e.g. Western World by number of its inhabitants, including Russia, up from the downfall of the Roman Empire (the Galliae have been the new rich among the western provinces), and maybe Spain and Italy. Quite all other countries tripled the inhabitants up from 1860, or even more, process which is now being repeated in less developed regions of the world.
France lost this position in 1870/71 when Preussen/Prussia, Sachsen/Saxonia, Bayern/Bavaria, Baden, Württemberg merged in the Deutsches Reich / German Empire. And the growing rates in recent decades were rather LOWER than in many other European countries.
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  #29  
Old 22.12.2012, 13:51
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Re: more than 8 014 000 people

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Those fields (including all other fields in Switzerland) can only feed a fraction of the swiss population. And there are very few houses here because in the past farmland was treasured unlike now where it's built over for single family homes and streets and shopping malls at a rate of ten football fields per day.
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  #30  
Old 22.12.2012, 14:21
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Re: more than 8 014 000 people

I wouldn't worry about it. I've watched my nation of birth (Great Britain) vanished in front of my very eyes.
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  #31  
Old 22.12.2012, 22:28
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Re: more than 8 014 000 people

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...
I think this map is probably more useful to see population density and real habitable land area of the country

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  #32  
Old 25.12.2012, 08:14
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Re: more than 8 014 000 people

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And half the UK has settled down in the La Cote area. Too much? Too little integration? It puts me upsise down to see Brits in Nyon buying their UK newspaper talking to the clerk exclusively in english
That is only until there is more than 2.3 cm of snow in Southern England for several days, flights stop and there will be no British papers arriving on the Continent (as the English say "the Continent is cut off") so that they grudgingly have to buy leTemps, leMonde + Liberation

or when the clerk gets replaced by somebody of Maghreb origin, whose English consists of
Yes Sir
Welcome Sir
Coffee Sir ?
Yes Sir, only look look ..... some coffee Sir ?
-
those Brits then will consider that their French is not as bad after all
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  #33  
Old 25.12.2012, 12:53
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Re: more than 8 014 000 people

Never underestimate the power of speaking loudly, and slowly, in English.

Johnny foreigner does understand after all.
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  #34  
Old 26.12.2012, 10:50
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Re: more than 8 014 000 people

What bothers me a lot here is the ageism. Employers dump an over 50 year old in favour of a younger new arrival, with less experience but happy to work for a lower salary.

Once an older person has used up all his unemployment credits, after around 18 months, he is no longer unemployed: he is on social security. And so the unemployment statistics look OK, but hide a local problem where local taxes are paying for good people to stay at home.

I believe if it was made harder for wannabe arrivals to be given a work permit, it would force employers to find work for active experienced workers. I was unemployed for 3 years until I found work with Swisscom, and then worked until I was 66 years old! During my 3 years I only met one person that deserved to be unemployed: all the others, maybe 50 people, were qualified, but simply out of luck and could not get a job.

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  #35  
Old 26.12.2012, 21:02
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Re: more than 8 014 000 people

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What bothers me a lot here is the ageism. Employers dump an over 50 year old in favour of a younger new arrival, with less experience but happy to work for a lower salary.

Once an older person has used up all his unemployment credits, after around 18 months, he is no longer unemployed: he is on social security. And so the unemployment statistics look OK, but hide a local problem where local taxes are paying for good people to stay at home.

I believe if it was made harder for wannabe arrivals to be given a work permit, it would force employers to find work for active experienced workers. I was unemployed for 3 years until I found work with Swisscom, and then worked until I was 66 years old! During my 3 years I only met one person that deserved to be unemployed: all the others, maybe 50 people, were qualified, but simply out of luck and could not get a job.

.
employers do not want to employ people between 56 and 63 for a variety of reasons
- fairly short time of possible employment
- high risk of illnessess
- fear that "those" folks already have fixed ideas
- fear that such "oldish" people are detested by the 25 to 45 years old
- fear that thosse "oldies" have some "sympathies"
- fear that those oldies may decide to go into retirement at 63 already
- the knowledge that the professional education of the "oldies" is dated
there is no chance that this will get changed. Not least as the "newcomers" generally are in the wished for age-group
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  #36  
Old 26.12.2012, 21:07
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Re: more than 8 014 000 people

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I think this map is probably more useful to see population density and real habitable land area of the country

Plenty of space where i live, lol (dark green). Had the pleasure to welcome the new-comers at a ceremony last week and asked them the question 'why here' and the reply was the same for all - huge apartments with garden/land very cheap - some also bought their own large property they could have never afforded elsewhere + amazing countryside, small classes and proximity to France.
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  #37  
Old 28.12.2012, 13:37
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Re: more than 8 014 000 people

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I wouldn't worry about it. I've watched my nation of birth (Great Britain) vanished in front of my very eyes.
According to results just issued from the 2011 UK census the percentage of "white British" in London is now 44.9
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  #38  
Old 28.12.2012, 20:16
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Re: more than 8 014 000 people

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According to results just issued from the 2011 UK census the percentage of "white British" in London is now 44.9
A lot may depend on how "white" is defined, in other words who is "accepted" as a "White"
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  #39  
Old 28.12.2012, 20:51
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Re: more than 8 014 000 people

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A lot may depend on how "white" is defined, in other words who is "accepted" as a "White"
People who complete the census form self select their category; copy of the question is below.

Last edited by marton; 08.12.2017 at 17:38.
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