Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Living in Switzerland > Swiss politics/news  
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #61  
Old 13.03.2014, 10:38
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: At home
Posts: 4,172
Groaned at 208 Times in 133 Posts
Thanked 6,403 Times in 2,719 Posts
Faltrad has a reputation beyond reputeFaltrad has a reputation beyond reputeFaltrad has a reputation beyond reputeFaltrad has a reputation beyond reputeFaltrad has a reputation beyond reputeFaltrad has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Carlos: the most hated person in Switzerland right now?

Quote:
View Post
You think anyone would have difficulty getting enough signatures for such a referendum?
Do you think SVP/UDC/PPS hadn't already done it if it was that easy to make the deportation of a Swiss citizen by its own country possible?

See, I can play the game who has the biggest rhetorical question too.
Reply With Quote
  #62  
Old 13.03.2014, 11:49
Dack Rambo's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 2,950
Groaned at 191 Times in 118 Posts
Thanked 1,906 Times in 936 Posts
Dack Rambo has an excellent reputationDack Rambo has an excellent reputationDack Rambo has an excellent reputationDack Rambo has an excellent reputation
Re: Carlos: the most hated person in Switzerland right now?

To Carlos victims, this is not a game. They have been left with lifelong injuries.
Reply With Quote
  #63  
Old 13.03.2014, 11:51
bigblue2's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Glarus
Posts: 8,086
Groaned at 486 Times in 405 Posts
Thanked 14,715 Times in 5,780 Posts
bigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Carlos: the most hated person in Switzerland right now?

I take it you have read the rather one sided victims version of events then? reads to me like it was a 2 against 1 fight and the victim was hardly blameless and is using this to try and get more compensation
Reply With Quote
This user groans at bigblue2 for this post:
  #64  
Old 13.03.2014, 12:12
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Zurich Unterland
Posts: 3,315
Groaned at 145 Times in 99 Posts
Thanked 4,850 Times in 1,930 Posts
smoky has a reputation beyond reputesmoky has a reputation beyond reputesmoky has a reputation beyond reputesmoky has a reputation beyond reputesmoky has a reputation beyond reputesmoky has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Carlos: the most hated person in Switzerland right now?

Quote:
View Post
When all is said and done this is why I tend to support rehabilitation; without it individuals tend to end up permanently anti-social, in-and-out of correctional facilities, that cost money, but additionally there is the opportunity cost of lost tax revenues that they would be paying where they productive members of society. Basically it makes financial sense to rehabilitate people - I don't say that as some tree-hugging liberal, but as someone concious of the bottom line; were grinding them up into Soylent Green more efficient, I'd likely favour that too.

To me, this Carlos case is more indicative of inefficient bureaucracy and a flawed program; where public sector social workers with more access to budget than grey matter end up wasting resources that the state will never recoup, even if the rehabilitation is successful, on someone who may not even be a viable candidate for rehabilitation.

My only concern is that such examples of bureaucratic waste, tend not to start debates on how the system is administered, when they go public via the (largely tabloid) media; instead the debate becomes a moral outrage or panic - half, if not more, of the comments even here have been about locking this guy up (or even castrating him), rather than the shortfalls in a system that clearly wasted so much money.

Such idiotic public reactions can lead to the classic 'hard cases make bad law' scenario, which ends up causing more long term harm than good.
By the age of 18, being an habitual criminal, it has become a lose/lose situation - these types cost tax money in attempts at re-habilitation, plus, really, does anyone actually believe an individual such as this is ever going to contribute to tax revenue?

Uncovering this combination of "lack of grey matter combined with excessive budgets" is what "investigative reporters" do for a living - tis how the public become aware of how their tax contributions are being put to use.

This is just ONE isolated case being used as an example of sheer public servant wastage of recourses. Sparking moral outrage and panic by the public speaks for itself, saying they are NOT happy with this situation.

Actually, at the end of the day - in my opinion - its the parents of these sorts who are in need of "re-habilitation" together with their offspring (and sterilization, to prevent them issuing and training more of the same monster types).

But most certainly, the moral outrage is gendered by the sheer luxury these types are being kept in.

In Arab countries, prisons are places to be feared, which creates a population of people who obey the laws. Why does no-one steal anything in those countries? ... because they get a hand lopped off! Prisons are places where prisoners have to rely on their own kind family and friends to bring them food.
A person who commits crimes has the knowledge that they have removed themselves from interacting freely in society. They are left to lie in their own dirt. This is what deters criminality.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank smoky for this useful post:
  #65  
Old 13.03.2014, 12:19
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Zurich Unterland
Posts: 3,315
Groaned at 145 Times in 99 Posts
Thanked 4,850 Times in 1,930 Posts
smoky has a reputation beyond reputesmoky has a reputation beyond reputesmoky has a reputation beyond reputesmoky has a reputation beyond reputesmoky has a reputation beyond reputesmoky has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Carlos: the most hated person in Switzerland right now?

Quote:
View Post
I take it you have read the rather one sided victims version of events then? reads to me like it was a 2 against 1 fight and the victim was hardly blameless and is using this to try and get more compensation
Victims have only one side to tell - what happened to them to get themselves stabbed. In this case the young man came to the defence of his father, and was viciously stabbed twice. Defending one`s father is a "2 against 1 situation"?

That`s the same as saying a husband defending his wife against an attacker is unfair because it was 2 against 1. Or a mother defending her child.

An older person being attacked by an 18 year old brute is at the same disadvantage as a weaker one. The "stronger" will attempt to come to their rescue, or intervene. It is no excuse to attempt to kill.

The man was stabbed so viciously and so deeply his lung was punctured, disabling him from his normal life he lead before being confronted with this Carlos character.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank smoky for this useful post:
  #66  
Old 13.03.2014, 12:23
bigblue2's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Glarus
Posts: 8,086
Groaned at 486 Times in 405 Posts
Thanked 14,715 Times in 5,780 Posts
bigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Carlos: the most hated person in Switzerland right now?

I have the perfect plan, we should build a huge wall round an island, leave all the building etc untouched, mine the water around the island and throw all the criminals over the wall, but first give them the option of execution rather then living on the island hell. Maybe somewhere like New York would be suitable? Then its just survival of the fittest.

Carlos can change his name to Snake Plissken
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank bigblue2 for this useful post:
  #67  
Old 13.03.2014, 12:25
bigblue2's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Glarus
Posts: 8,086
Groaned at 486 Times in 405 Posts
Thanked 14,715 Times in 5,780 Posts
bigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Carlos: the most hated person in Switzerland right now?

Quote:
View Post
Victims have only one side to tell - what happened to them to get themselves stabbed. In this case the young man came to the defence of his father, and was viciously stabbed twice. Defending one`s father is a "2 against 1 situation"?

That`s the same as saying a husband defending his wife against an attacker is unfair because it was 2 against 1. Or a mother defending her child.

An older person being attacked by an 18 year old brute is at the same disadvantage as a weaker one. The "stronger" will attempt to come to their rescue, or intervene. It is no excuse to attempt to kill.

The man was stabbed so viciously and so deeply his lung was punctured, disabling him from his normal life he lead before being confronted with this Carlos character.

This was the version of events as the father told the paper, while saying he should get more compensation.

I'm sure carlos's version would be quite different, the only thing we know for sure is someone was stabbed.
Reply With Quote
  #68  
Old 13.03.2014, 12:41
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Zurich Unterland
Posts: 3,315
Groaned at 145 Times in 99 Posts
Thanked 4,850 Times in 1,930 Posts
smoky has a reputation beyond reputesmoky has a reputation beyond reputesmoky has a reputation beyond reputesmoky has a reputation beyond reputesmoky has a reputation beyond reputesmoky has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Carlos: the most hated person in Switzerland right now?

Quote:
View Post
This was the version of events as the father told the paper, while saying he should get more compensation.

I'm sure carlos's version would be quite different, the only thing we know for sure is someone was stabbed.
We also know *Carlos* has been leading a life of criminality from the age of 9 years old, has had previous convictions of assault, committing 34 crimes in a space of five years.

BUT he has improved - he`s not committed any crimes in the last 24 months. Amazing hey? Why? Because he was isolated from society, obviously.

The system had gotten out of control, read this .......

http://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/swiss_ne...l?cid=36935366
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank smoky for this useful post:
  #69  
Old 13.03.2014, 12:52
Dack Rambo's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 2,950
Groaned at 191 Times in 118 Posts
Thanked 1,906 Times in 936 Posts
Dack Rambo has an excellent reputationDack Rambo has an excellent reputationDack Rambo has an excellent reputationDack Rambo has an excellent reputation
Re: Carlos: the most hated person in Switzerland right now?

Quote:
View Post
Victims have only one side to tell - what happened to them to get themselves stabbed. In this case the young man came to the defence of his father, and was viciously stabbed twice. Defending one`s father is a "2 against 1 situation"?

That`s the same as saying a husband defending his wife against an attacker is unfair because it was 2 against 1. Or a mother defending her child.

An older person being attacked by an 18 year old brute is at the same disadvantage as a weaker one. The "stronger" will attempt to come to their rescue, or intervene. It is no excuse to attempt to kill.

The man was stabbed so viciously and so deeply his lung was punctured, disabling him from his normal life he lead before being confronted with this Carlos character.
That is a really great summing up of the situation, thanks a lot. These people defending Carlos would probably also defend rapists and scum who mug elderly people.
Reply With Quote
  #70  
Old 13.03.2014, 12:57
Aeneas's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Winterthur, ZH
Posts: 1,073
Groaned at 41 Times in 34 Posts
Thanked 1,172 Times in 575 Posts
Aeneas has a reputation beyond reputeAeneas has a reputation beyond reputeAeneas has a reputation beyond reputeAeneas has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Carlos: the most hated person in Switzerland right now?

Quote:
View Post
By the age of 18, being an habitual criminal, it has become a lose/lose situation - these types cost tax money in attempts at re-habilitation, plus, really, does anyone actually believe an individual such as this is ever going to contribute to tax revenue?
Yet you yourself gave an example earlier of former criminals who did exactly that - so unless you wish to contradict yourself, you would need to accept that one can actually believe an individual such as this could contribute to tax revenue.

How this is best achieved, in which cases, and so on, is another debate, I completely agree.
Quote:
Uncovering this combination of "lack of grey matter combined with excessive budgets" is what "investigative reporters" do for a living - tis how the public become aware of how their tax contributions are being put to use.
Totally agree, but most of the media coverage on this case is no longer the product of investigative reporting, but of tabloid journalism now.
Quote:
This is just ONE isolated case being used as an example of sheer public servant wastage of recourses. Sparking moral outrage and panic by the public speaks for itself, saying they are NOT happy with this situation.
I think you're confusing public disquiet or 'unhappiness' with moral outrage and panic. When I cited the latter, I was referring to the tendency for the public to see a problem and instead of attempting to seek a rational and informed solution, instead go for a short term, flawed and simplistic one.

It is perfectly reasonable that people are not happy, I even suggested that a debate on reform of how such programs are carried out should be welcomed. What I criticized is not that people are not happy, but how they manifest this; turning to moronic knee-jerk reactions, such as deporting citizens (which isn't even legal, let alone the dangers of such a precedence).
Quote:
Actually, at the end of the day - in my opinion - its the parents of these sorts who are in need of "re-habilitation" together with their offspring (and sterilization, to prevent them issuing and training more of the same monster types).
More often than not, I'd agree with you; but realistically you'd still need to judge on a case-by-case basis, with all the facts.
Quote:
In Arab countries, prisons are places to be feared, which creates a population of people who obey the laws. Why does no-one steal anything in those countries? ... because they get a hand lopped off! Prisons are places where prisoners have to rely on their own kind family and friends to bring them food.
Fair enough, but bare in mind that that's not the only thing that Arab countries tend to have in common; you can't have your cake an eat it, I'm afraid.
Quote:
A person who commits crimes has the knowledge that they have removed themselves from interacting freely in society. They are left to lie in their own dirt. This is what deters criminality.
Actually a sense of social morality, empathy and guilt, imprinted during childhood, is what deters criminality; the fear of getting caught is actually not why people tend not to commit crimes.

Or are you saying that the only reason you don't commit murder is because you don't want to go to prison?
Reply With Quote
  #71  
Old 13.03.2014, 12:58
Dack Rambo's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 2,950
Groaned at 191 Times in 118 Posts
Thanked 1,906 Times in 936 Posts
Dack Rambo has an excellent reputationDack Rambo has an excellent reputationDack Rambo has an excellent reputationDack Rambo has an excellent reputation
Re: Carlos: the most hated person in Switzerland right now?

Quote:
View Post
I have the perfect plan, we should build a huge wall round an island, leave all the building etc untouched, mine the water around the island and throw all the criminals over the wall, but first give them the option of execution rather then living on the island hell. Maybe somewhere like New York would be suitable? Then its just survival of the fittest.

Carlos can change his name to Snake Plissken
What's wrong with New York? I've been there a few times and it seems to be quite a nice place.
Reply With Quote
  #72  
Old 13.03.2014, 13:06
bigblue2's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Glarus
Posts: 8,086
Groaned at 486 Times in 405 Posts
Thanked 14,715 Times in 5,780 Posts
bigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Carlos: the most hated person in Switzerland right now?

Quote:
View Post
We also know *Carlos* has been leading a life of criminality from the age of 9 years old, has had previous convictions of assault, committing 34 crimes in a space of five years.

BUT he has improved - he`s not committed any crimes in the last 24 months. Amazing hey? Why? Because he was isolated from society, obviously.

The system had gotten out of control, read this .......

http://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/swiss_ne...l?cid=36935366

maybe he hasn't committed any crimes because he now has some focus and positive roles models in his life?? as well as being removed from the crowd he was mixing with??

Do you accept that its worth trying to fix him? and if successful will save a whole ton of cash in the long run?
Reply With Quote
  #73  
Old 13.03.2014, 13:14
Dack Rambo's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 2,950
Groaned at 191 Times in 118 Posts
Thanked 1,906 Times in 936 Posts
Dack Rambo has an excellent reputationDack Rambo has an excellent reputationDack Rambo has an excellent reputationDack Rambo has an excellent reputation
Re: Carlos: the most hated person in Switzerland right now?

Quote:
View Post
maybe he hasn't committed any crimes because he now has some focus and positive roles models in his life?? as well as being removed from the crowd he was mixing with??

Do you accept that its worth trying to fix him? and if successful will save a whole ton of cash in the long run?
so you now accept that he needs to be "fixed"? what happened to 2 vs. 1?
Reply With Quote
  #74  
Old 13.03.2014, 13:16
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Zurich Unterland
Posts: 3,315
Groaned at 145 Times in 99 Posts
Thanked 4,850 Times in 1,930 Posts
smoky has a reputation beyond reputesmoky has a reputation beyond reputesmoky has a reputation beyond reputesmoky has a reputation beyond reputesmoky has a reputation beyond reputesmoky has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Carlos: the most hated person in Switzerland right now?

Quote:
View Post
Yet you yourself gave an example earlier of former criminals who did exactly that - so unless you wish to contradict yourself, you would need to accept that one can actually believe an individual such as this could contribute to tax revenue.

How this is best achieved, in which cases, and so on, is another debate, I completely agree.
Totally agree, but most of the media coverage on this case is no longer the product of investigative reporting, but of tabloid journalism now.
I think you're confusing public disquiet or 'unhappiness' with moral outrage and panic. When I cited the latter, I was referring to the tendency for the public to see a problem and instead of attempting to seek a rational and informed solution, instead go for a short term, flawed and simplistic one.

It is perfectly reasonable that people are not happy, I even suggested that a debate on reform of how such programs are carried out should be welcomed. What I criticized is not that people are not happy, but how they manifest this; turning to moronic knee-jerk reactions, such as deporting citizens (which isn't even legal, let alone the dangers of such a precedence).
More often than not, I'd agree with you; but realistically you'd still need to judge on a case-by-case basis, with all the facts.
Fair enough, but bare in mind that that's not the only thing that Arab countries tend to have in common; you can't have your cake an eat it, I'm afraid.
Actually a sense of social morality, empathy and guilt, imprinted during childhood, is what deters criminality; the fear of getting caught is actually not why people tend not to commit crimes.

Or are you saying that the only reason you don't commit murder is because you don't want to go to prison?
The example I quoted does not align with this *Carlos* case. The prisoners I mentioned were people incarcerated in prisons and made to do manual labour (for their own good - ie-food supply)
Only once they had proved their change of attitude were they allowed outside into relative but restricted freedom.

Not the same as being housed in a private apartment, given Sfr1,000 pocket money a month, plus all the other luxuries provided, being trained in a form of martial art.

The public reaction is to be horrified at this form of "rehabilitation" of a violent thug and the costs incurred - which if you read the link you`ll find the authorities themselves seemed to be unaware of just how this had escalated out of control, but which they are now attempting to reduce without reducing the actual rehabilitation. Just curbing it to a more realistic level. Is a convicted criminal really entitled to regular monthy "pocket money" of Sfr1,000? ... without doing anything to "earn" it?

Oh yes, there have been a few times in my life when I could have quite vengefully and spontaneously have killed someone - but the thought of spending my life in prison for those moments of "self-satisfaction" was a great deterrent. It made me give more thought to my behaviour.

Humans are natural born killers. We kill when we have no further thought than our own immediate warped satisfaction. And we have learned over the centuries that it does us no good as a society to allow ourselves this satisfaction. We also have a concience that prevents us doing this.
Those without this concience are those that roam the streets and attack kill others.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank smoky for this useful post:
  #75  
Old 13.03.2014, 13:17
Aeneas's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Winterthur, ZH
Posts: 1,073
Groaned at 41 Times in 34 Posts
Thanked 1,172 Times in 575 Posts
Aeneas has a reputation beyond reputeAeneas has a reputation beyond reputeAeneas has a reputation beyond reputeAeneas has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Carlos: the most hated person in Switzerland right now?

Quote:
View Post
maybe he hasn't committed any crimes because he now has some focus and positive roles models in his life?? as well as being removed from the crowd he was mixing with??

Do you accept that its worth trying to fix him? and if successful will save a whole ton of cash in the long run?
Maybe. Maybe not. It's also entirely possible that Carlos was a poor candidate for rehabilitation to begin with and that he's a lost cause that we're better off locking up and throwing away the key on.

Thing is, if that is the case, this does not mean that rehabilitation does not work, that we should just lock everyone up, deport them or turn them into Soylent Green and curtail everyone's civil rights in the name of security - I would have thought that by now that there are unpleasant side effects to such approaches.

It just means that it doesn't always work and we should learn from this case and reform our use of rehabilitation as an option in the future so that it may more efficiently be applied to cases where it can make a difference.
Reply With Quote
  #76  
Old 13.03.2014, 13:22
bigblue2's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Glarus
Posts: 8,086
Groaned at 486 Times in 405 Posts
Thanked 14,715 Times in 5,780 Posts
bigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Carlos: the most hated person in Switzerland right now?

Quote:
View Post
so you now accept that he needs to be "fixed"? what happened to 2 vs. 1?
he stabbed a guy, of course he needs fixing, I've never denied he is a wrong'en have I? simply pointing out that 2 people where fighting against him, and at his age he could still be turned around.

Been in trouble since 9 kinda tells you he is from a very broken home and really deserves some breaks
Reply With Quote
  #77  
Old 13.03.2014, 14:08
MidfieldGeneral's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Zürich
Posts: 1,459
Groaned at 85 Times in 79 Posts
Thanked 2,934 Times in 1,201 Posts
MidfieldGeneral has a reputation beyond reputeMidfieldGeneral has a reputation beyond reputeMidfieldGeneral has a reputation beyond reputeMidfieldGeneral has a reputation beyond reputeMidfieldGeneral has a reputation beyond reputeMidfieldGeneral has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Carlos: the most hated person in Switzerland right now?

Quote:
View Post
.

In Arab countries, prisons are places to be feared, which creates a population of people who obey the laws. Why does no-one steal anything in those countries? ... because they get a hand lopped off! Prisons are places where prisoners have to rely on their own kind family and friends to bring them food.
A person who commits crimes has the knowledge that they have removed themselves from interacting freely in society. They are left to lie in their own dirt. This is what deters criminality.
this is the most stupid thing I have read on this thread and I can tell you the competition is fierce.

are you seriously advocating a Shariah style justice and legal system for Switzerland? I have lived in Saudi and Bahrain for several years and their justice systems are shameful. I lived there in my youthful days and I look back on those years with regret as the people suffer there daily. I would never go back and work there

Last edited by MidfieldGeneral; 13.03.2014 at 14:29.
Reply With Quote
  #78  
Old 13.03.2014, 14:16
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Zurich Unterland
Posts: 3,315
Groaned at 145 Times in 99 Posts
Thanked 4,850 Times in 1,930 Posts
smoky has a reputation beyond reputesmoky has a reputation beyond reputesmoky has a reputation beyond reputesmoky has a reputation beyond reputesmoky has a reputation beyond reputesmoky has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Carlos: the most hated person in Switzerland right now?

Quote:
View Post
this is the most stupid thing I have read on this thread and I can tell you the competition is fierce.

are you seriously advocating a Shariah style justice and legal system for Switzerland? I have lived in Saudi and Bahrain for several years and their justice systems are shameful. I lived there in my youthful days and I look back on those years with regret as the people suffer there daily.
Ok, first I answer your post. And then we get back to the more interesting threads.

Having lived in Saudi and Bahrain did you not notice the level of theft is almost nil?

I forgot my wallet once on a counter in a shop there, only missing it hours later. It was still on the counter when I returned. Amazing hey?

Can you imagine that happening here in Switzerland in the last few years? Or anywhere else?

Yes, their general justic system of Arabic lands is shameful. But their crime deterrent is pretty good, as it works. They have no need to spend their oil money on rehabilitation of criminals, as the publics fear of jail sentences is enough deterrent.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank smoky for this useful post:
  #79  
Old 13.03.2014, 14:23
MidfieldGeneral's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Zürich
Posts: 1,459
Groaned at 85 Times in 79 Posts
Thanked 2,934 Times in 1,201 Posts
MidfieldGeneral has a reputation beyond reputeMidfieldGeneral has a reputation beyond reputeMidfieldGeneral has a reputation beyond reputeMidfieldGeneral has a reputation beyond reputeMidfieldGeneral has a reputation beyond reputeMidfieldGeneral has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Carlos: the most hated person in Switzerland right now?

Quote:
View Post
Ok, first I answer your post. And then we get back to the more interesting threads.

Having lived in Saudi and Bahrain did you not notice the level of theft is almost nil?

I forgot my wallet once on a counter in a shop there, only missing it hours later. It was still on the counter when I returned. Amazing hey?

Can you imagine that happening here in Switzerland in the last few years? Or anywhere else?

Yes, their general justic system of Arabic lands is shameful. But their crime deterrent is pretty good, as it works. They have no need to spend their oil money on rehabilitation of criminals, as the publics fear of jail sentences is enough deterrent.
in "Arab countries" as you call them, people can get their hands cut off for stealing bread. do you have any idea how unjustly people are treated in these countries by their own despotic governments?

is this form of justice good for you? no one is saying on this thread what is happening to Carlos is a good thing and things clearly have to be improved but give me a Western style justice and legal system warts and all ANY DAY to Shariah.
Reply With Quote
  #80  
Old 13.03.2014, 14:24
Ace1's Avatar
A modal singularity
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Morgins, VS (and Alsace)
Posts: 9,137
Groaned at 369 Times in 240 Posts
Thanked 15,621 Times in 6,745 Posts
Ace1 has a reputation beyond reputeAce1 has a reputation beyond reputeAce1 has a reputation beyond reputeAce1 has a reputation beyond reputeAce1 has a reputation beyond reputeAce1 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Carlos: the most hated person in Switzerland right now?

Quote:
View Post
I forgot my wallet once on a counter in a shop there, only missing it hours later. It was still on the counter when I returned. Amazing hey?

Can you imagine that happening here in Switzerland in the last few years?
Err, yes, absolutely. A quick click-through with the search function will find you many examples from previous postings here.

But anyway, why stop at cutting their hands and feet off? Let's just return to better days when theft was punishable by hanging, eh? What's that you say? It still is in some muslim countries? Well I never. They must be great places to live then
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank Ace1 for this useful post:
Reply

Tags
carlos




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Just how tough is the apartment rental market in Lausanne right now? Amiller Housing in general 21 18.03.2013 14:43
First the right to die, now the right to live Medea Fleecestealer International affairs/politics 31 14.09.2012 11:19
Most beautiful cities in Switzerland - vote now! argus Daily life 65 19.06.2010 01:03
Is everyone on EF in Switzerland right now? yupnya Daily life 45 21.02.2010 18:03
Why the Japs are still hated in Asia champson International affairs/politics 65 16.01.2007 16:01


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 07:12.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0