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Old 28.05.2014, 12:01
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Re: Zürich - Swiss champions in cocaine use

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A more detailed analysis would probably find that most of it originates from waste water from the buildings in the Paradeplatz area...


Apparently not really - this research has been ongoing for some years and some of the results were that during streetparade the values went LITERALLY off the chart. As in "we cannot measure it with certainty anymore as the test was not designed for this high concentrations". I remember we had a discussion on that article back then here, must be somewhere... bottom line: Cocaine was a yuppie drug in the 80s because it was expensive and basically showed a social status (vs. other drugs like Heroin). Today it seems to be affordable for the young Swiss raver as well...
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Old 28.05.2014, 13:47
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Re: Zürich - Swiss champions in cocaine use

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Apparently not really - this research has been ongoing for some years and some of the results were that during streetparade the values went LITERALLY off the chart. As in "we cannot measure it with certainty anymore as the test was not designed for this high concentrations". I remember we had a discussion on that article back then here, must be somewhere... bottom line: Cocaine was a yuppie drug in the 80s because it was expensive and basically showed a social status (vs. other drugs like Heroin). Today it seems to be affordable for the young Swiss raver as well...
It's depressing. Am I naieve or can we prevent this?
I'm about to chomp on quiche we made with my kid then dress her and me up (identically, hahah) and truck her and me to conservatoire where we play a little gig together. We will probably pull a couple of ears with some off notes. I know parental and school involvement at certain sensitive time of a kid development can't do miracles. But is there a way that a destructive stuff will lose appeal? I see it as a societal phenomenon. Not something certain level of income would lead to more than other... Not sure. I think society lacks in quality stimuli. Bored folks, young and old, are more likely to get themselves into a trouble.
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  #23  
Old 28.05.2014, 14:10
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Re: Zürich - Swiss champions in cocaine use

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First of all, this report was in 20 Minuten. A publication that I believe is significantly motivated by the sensationalist value of content. And second of all... how many cities (outside of CH) would have the resources (or the political motivation) to measure drug levels in waste water on a regular and frequent basis.
Waste water gets tested all the time? Outside of CH. So is air quality, and other sensible stuff. By the way, labs are so expensive here, Swiss testing gets regularly done in France (as per rts the other day). Ha!
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Old 28.05.2014, 14:14
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Re: Zürich - Swiss champions in cocaine use

Just wondering out aloud if Zürich's coke levels will spike this week around the Letzigrund area, especially in the over 60s category?
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Old 28.05.2014, 14:40
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Re: Zürich - Swiss champions in cocaine use

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Just wondering out aloud if Zürich's coke levels will spike this week around the Letzigrund area, especially in the over 60s category?
Isn't it going to be more of a fug of the homegrown herbal variety..?
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Old 28.05.2014, 18:43
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Re: Zürich - Swiss champions in cocaine use

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I'm also not surprised...

I think a lot of people in Zurich are really stressed out. And many also earn enough to support their habit. It reminds me of an anti-drug commercial in the US a few years ago, that shows a guy walking in circles inside a public restroom saying over and over to himself:

"I do coke, so I can work longer, so I can earn more, so I can do more coke..."

Nasty stuff. I've never touched it myself (thankfully!), but I've been at parties where people were doing it, and all I could think was: "You really don't look like you're having a good time" (the creepy jaw grinding thing, etc.). Yuck.
Some people take drugs because they just want to, and they enjoy it. It's the main reason that endless governments campaigns against drugs don't do any good, because the message is drugs are taken out of boredom, pressure, ego, abuse you name it, missing out possibly the one reason people do take drugs: because they make you feel great for a while.

Nasty stuff for one may be quite an enjoyable experience for another. Watching people being sick and fighting in the street because they are hopelessly drunk doesn't give the nicest impression of alcohol either, but it is rarely demonized like "drugs" are.

No drug is ideal, there will be addicts, idiots, people prone to violence and people who die on them, but there will be a significant subset who take them, enjoy it, and then lead normal successful lives - much to the consternation of the anti-drugs crowd.
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Old 28.05.2014, 19:23
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Re: Zürich - Swiss champions in cocaine use

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Some people take drugs because they just want to, and they enjoy it. It's the main reason that endless governments campaigns against drugs don't do any good, because the message is drugs are taken out of boredom, pressure, ego, abuse you name it, missing out possibly the one reason people do take drugs: because they make you feel great for a while.

Nasty stuff for one may be quite an enjoyable experience for another. Watching people being sick and fighting in the street because they are hopelessly drunk doesn't give the nicest impression of alcohol either, but it is rarely demonized like "drugs" are.

No drug is ideal, there will be addicts, idiots, people prone to violence and people who die on them, but there will be a significant subset who take them, enjoy it, and then lead normal successful lives - much to the consternation of the anti-drugs crowd.
Exactly. There's a big difference between recreational use and addiction. It's all about moderation and dependency.

I'm guessing some people here may experience a bit of depression if all of a sudden the EF site went down for a week.... NO ???
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Old 28.05.2014, 21:44
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Re: Zürich - Swiss champions in cocaine use

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According to this report from 20 Minuten, Zürich's population is using 1.6Kg of cocaine every day. Extrapolating figures from data measuring waste water over a period of a week, the figure puts Zürich as #1 city for cocaine use in Switzerland and number 3 in Europe behind Amsterdam and Antwerp.

In light of this announcement and Zürich's traditional city links with Kunming, China and San Francisco, may it not be a valid idea to also hook up with Medellín. Colombia?

Anyone out there like to confirm these figures? I'll go first; I've never touched the stuff in my life.
You should contact President Mrs Mauch immediately

We already have partnerships with SFO

and Kunming
https://www.stadt-zuerich.ch/chinagarten
www.stadt-zuerich.ch/chinagarten

and defacto links to Vinnitsa/Ukraine



and the Forchbahn in Antananarivo may get into swing thanks to the Chinese
http://blog.buetikofer.net/2010/11/2...in-madagaskar/
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Old 28.05.2014, 22:10
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Re: Zürich - Swiss champions in cocaine use

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I think the average banker in Zurich does not need cocaine in order to have an inflated ego. The drug makes them lose their inhibitions to talk to people and tell them how awesome they always thought they are...
I am just wondering to what extent bankers are more relevant in regard to cocaine than masons, carpenters, or electricians or shop-salesmen or tram/train-personnel or kiosk-personnel or motorcar-mechanics. YES, they have lots of money

The figures shown hint to the point that the habit is relatively widespread in the main-population

As I never consumed drugs I have no clue what a full addict needs of cocaine per day. I however do not believe that anybody consumes cocaine by the kilo per day
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Old 28.05.2014, 22:22
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Re: Zürich - Swiss champions in cocaine use

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Sports. Sex...but these things require effort. And, most of all, they do not sell.
Oh I beg to differ
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Old 28.05.2014, 22:47
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Re: Zürich - Swiss champions in cocaine use

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Some people take drugs because they just want to, and they enjoy it. It's the main reason that endless governments campaigns against drugs don't do any good, because the message is drugs are taken out of boredom, pressure, ego, abuse you name it, missing out possibly the one reason people do take drugs: because they make you feel great for a while.

Nasty stuff for one may be quite an enjoyable experience for another. Watching people being sick and fighting in the street because they are hopelessly drunk doesn't give the nicest impression of alcohol either, but it is rarely demonized like "drugs" are.

No drug is ideal, there will be addicts, idiots, people prone to violence and people who die on them, but there will be a significant subset who take them, enjoy it, and then lead normal successful lives - much to the consternation of the anti-drugs crowd.
difference is that, although alcohol also creates a lot of problems (too many of my friends are alcoholics, it ain't pretty), cocaine does not only affect the people who snort in the toilets of swish bar in Zurich, it make life hell for people half a world away. These people are forced through poverty or other horrible circumstances to grow and traffic the stuff, etc, etc., just so some bored effen idiots in some rich city can think they are the shits. Which they literally are.

Rant over.
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Old 28.05.2014, 23:04
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Re: Zürich - Swiss champions in cocaine use

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difference is that, although alcohol also creates a lot of problems (too many of my friends are alcoholics, it ain't pretty), cocaine does not only affect the people who snort in the toilets of swish bar in Zurich, it make life hell for people half a world away. These people are forced through poverty or other horrible circumstances to grow and traffic the stuff, etc, etc., just so some bored effen idiots in some rich city can think they are the shits. Which they literally are.

Rant over.
So not unlike the clothing or electronics industries then, where hideous working conditions and child labour are rife. Or food. Or manufacturing. Or anything really as western consumerism ignores the polite fact that poor people nearly kill themselves to make it for pittance.

But as you say, that's different, because it's not drugs - and drugs are evil.
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Old 28.05.2014, 23:27
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Re: Zürich - Swiss champions in cocaine use

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So not unlike the clothing or electronics industries then, where hideous working conditions and child labour are rife. Or food. Or manufacturing. Or anything really as western consumerism ignores the polite fact that poor people nearly kill themselves to make it for pittance.

But as you say, that's different, because it's not drugs - and drugs are evil.

To right those wrongs you can boycott manufacturers, write petitions, pay more for fair trade products, vote for better working conditions or stricter regulations etc. Good luck trying to boycott a drug mafia.

I didn't say drugs are different, I said there is said difference between alcohol and cocaine. Illegal drugs aren't evil but they breed an evil system. Legalise and tax the whole sad lot of them. I don't know if that would make it any better but maybe worth a try.
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Old 29.05.2014, 00:18
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Re: Zürich - Swiss champions in cocaine use

...and the 2014 award for "The Cocaine Capital of Europe" goes to... http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...y-9444107.html
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Old 29.05.2014, 08:04
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Re: Zürich - Swiss champions in cocaine use

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Legalise and tax the whole sad lot of them. I don't know if that would make it any better but maybe worth a try.
I've always thought this would be better, and safer. Same for all forms of prostitution. Where there are humans, there will always be drugs and prostitutes. Seems to me a good proportion of the danger comes from the lack of regulations due to these businesses being underground (although it's true like you say there can still be people who suffer from legit businesses like textiles. I would imagine though that legalisation would cut at least some of the risks. Harmful adulterants and unreliable doses etc). I don't know if I am being naive, but I don't understand why governments wouldn't want to make money off of legal recreational drugs in the same way they do off of tobacco products wonder if they benefit more somehow from the drugs remaining illegal? I wrote a paper on this in 2001 for my A-levels, I got an A* and was quite surprised at the time, someone older and wiser than me seemed to agree anyway
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Old 29.05.2014, 08:18
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Re: Zürich - Swiss champions in cocaine use

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Yeah, perhaps. I always thought cocaine was a "party drug," so a lot of people in Zurich probably do use it just as a means to ease boredom. I think a lot of people also use it because they feel it makes socializing (e.g. in clubs) easier for them. From what I've seen, it really inflates people's egos.

Who knows...
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I think the average banker in Zurich does not need cocaine in order to have an inflated ego. The drug makes them lose their inhibitions to talk to people and tell them how awesome they always thought they are...
Cocaine wakes up the brain. Makes people think sharper. It give them a sense of energy and power. They feel they can achieve more as they don't need to sleep much and it cuts the appetite. It also change the personality of the addict. Can become extremely selfish, arrogant, impatient and violent.
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Old 29.05.2014, 08:19
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Re: Zürich - Swiss champions in cocaine use

SUGAR is the evil killer at the moment according to some. How much is in our water! Will no one ever think of the children?
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Old 29.05.2014, 08:33
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Re: Zürich - Swiss champions in cocaine use

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It's depressing. Am I naieve or can we prevent this? ...
Unfortunately, I'm not sure how much can be done to prevent it (unless we can somehow find a way to get it all off the streets in general). I think many young kids, in particular, have a certain... illusion of immortality... about them. They think they're indestructible and often have no real understanding of consequences (this has to be learned in time and through experience -- sometimes learned the hard way). This was certainly the case for me, when I was young, and for many of my friends.

I think many parents do all that they feel they can do, to try to prevent it from happening to their own kids. But still, once the kids begin to grow up, it's like a dice roll. We cannot shelter them from reality, and it's all a bit random -- what they will be exposed to, what type of peers they will follow, etc. I think the most important thing is to try to instill in your child a strong sense of self-worth. Every drug addict I have ever known seems to value their own lives very little and have a bit of a self-loathing thing going on. I guess this is why it's so easy for them to self-destruct.
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Old 29.05.2014, 08:40
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Re: Zürich - Swiss champions in cocaine use

I tired snorting coke once but the bubbles kept making me sneeze.
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Old 29.05.2014, 09:02
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Re: Zürich - Swiss champions in cocaine use

"Psychis" these days are full of current and former drug-abusers.
I've got a school-mate who used to smoke weed and was a bit on the legalize-it bandwaggon. He now works in social-services at one of the rehab-centers in Germany and has a more realistic view of it.
As for the people who claim that legalizing and taxing the stuff would solve a lot of problems - they haven't thought it through, either.
You're still going to have to source the stuff from the South-American cartels (who will become even more powerful and don't even need to launder their money any more) or from an Afghan drug/war-lord, who will most certainly not use the money to build girl-schools and hospitals in the backcountry, putting the rest into his pension-fund.
Even if you ignore/dismiss the above, to execute some level of steering-function, you'd have to tax it a lot - opening up a giant market for smuggling.
And if you don't tax it (or very little, to make smuggling unattractive) you end-up with the equivalent of a "Prix Garantie" drug fix that every child can buy from his pocket money.
Not a world I want to live in.
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