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Old 13.11.2018, 12:48
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Re: Zurich company illegally supports the European Right

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I don't get the outrage here, ...
Where's the outrage?

The thread just points the story out with further information as it happens. Nobody seems to be clutching at their pearls.
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  #22  
Old 13.11.2018, 12:52
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Re: Zurich company illegally supports the European Right

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Where's the outrage?

The thread just points the story out with further information as it happens. Nobody seems to be clutching at their pearls.
I meant generally, she’s been called on to resign over the matter within Germany.
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Old 13.11.2018, 13:01
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Re: Zurich company illegally supports the European Right

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I meant generally, she’s been called on to resign over the matter within Germany.
I don't think anybody is bothered much about the amount. As you said, it's not all that much - so why divide it into even smaller bits?
Why send it from the EU to Switzerland and back to the EU? The whole thing is so amateurish that I can't stop wondering if it was a scam against AfD. LOL. Only fair, I guess
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Old 13.11.2018, 14:40
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Re: Zurich company illegally supports the European Right

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I meant generally, she’s been called on to resign over the matter within Germany.
Still not exactly outrageous. Break rules or protocol and you have to expect disciplinary action. Same would have happened if she'd broken a colleague's nose or sold intellectual property to a rival, right?

Why the obsession with "outrage" above all else?
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Old 13.11.2018, 15:39
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Re: Zurich company illegally supports the European Right

1. I know that 150k does not sound much to some people here. I was a long time ago active in one of the two major political parties of Germany and I can tell you that on a local communal level... that's a lot of money. The AfD had last year less than 4000 members in Baden Wuertemberg. That state has 39 electoral areas and Alice Weidel was a candidate in one of them. So its 150k CHF for a local unit of maybe 100 party members... that's a massive amount for rural Germany for one election campaign for an individual donation. There is a reason why anything over 50k has to be reported to Berlin immediately. (Yes, industry lobby groups have higher budgets, but they also have higher costs buying all that cocaine and hookers...)
The typical sanction against any party accepting an illegal donation and failing to reject or at least report it is three times the amount to be paid to the federal parliament. 450k will kill the finances of the AFD in the entire region.

2. I don't think I am outraged, but: I do not believe for a split second that a Swiss company is paying this. Its clearly a letter box company and by now the owner said he "did this on behalf of a friend". That's simply either money laundering or corruption and I would like to know who is stirring the shit in the same way any Brit has an interest to know who is behind UKIP.
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Old 13.11.2018, 15:41
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Re: Zurich company illegally supports the European Right

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Still not exactly outrageous. Break rules or protocol and you have to expect disciplinary action. Same would have happened if she'd broken a colleague's nose or sold intellectual property to a rival, right?

Why the obsession with "outrage" above all else?
What obsession? ROFL. Funny how people don't read posts but see posters and just go "eeek, must be BS, after all the last 25 of their posts were BS".

However, while I really think it would be great if AfD wouldn't exist: What rule did she break (proven yet)? The money went to the account of the party. There is a treasurer or maybe simply a book-keeper in charge of that.

Not the same thing as if she'd broken someone's nose or sold intellectual property as unless she sent that money to the account herself (not proven - yet) she didn't do a darn thing.

The world is simply not gonna work if we all go Trumpian.

And please Sandgrounder don't take this personal. I reply to posts not posters (unless it's a joke/banter subject).
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Old 13.11.2018, 15:52
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Re: Zurich company illegally supports the European Right

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The typical sanction against any party accepting an illegal donation and failing to reject or at least report it is three times the amount to be paid to the federal parliament.
"I'm sending you €150k. Please can you forward it to AfD?"

"Of course, Frau Merkel"
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Old 13.11.2018, 15:53
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Re: Zurich company illegally supports the European Right

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What obsession? ROFL. Funny how people don't read posts but see posters and just go "eeek, must be BS, after all the last 25 of their posts were BS".

However, while I really think it would be great if AfD wouldn't exist: What rule did she break (proven yet)? The money went to the account of the party. There is a treasurer or maybe simply a book-keeper in charge of that.

Not the same thing as if she'd broken someone's nose or sold intellectual property as unless she sent that money to the account herself (not proven - yet) she didn't do a darn thing.

The world is simply not gonna work if we all go Trumpian.

And please Sandgrounder don't take this personal. I reply to posts not posters (unless it's a joke/banter subject).
Didn't take it personally, just trying to figure out where was the "outrage" that Loz was seeing.
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  #29  
Old 13.11.2018, 16:17
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Re: Zurich company illegally supports the European Right

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What rule did she break (proven yet)? The money went to the account of the party. There is a treasurer or maybe simply a book-keeper in charge of that.
That simple bookkeeper informed her about the donation. She does not deny it but in fact confirmed it. She did not see it as her job to worry about it and told the bookkeeper to talk to the treasurer of the province.


Alice Weidel is not a simple bookkeeper, she is a member of parliament. Former Goldman Sachs, PhD in economy and a financial professional. If that little bookkeeper tells her "I got some Swiss dude sending us 9k every week and it amounts to 130k EUR by now" should all alarm bells go off. But they didn't.


Since you asked about rules broken:
- she accepted the donation and did not ask the bookkeeper to send it back immediately (25.2. of the linked law below)
- she did not inform her boss, the head of the parliament for receiving a donation over 50k. (25.3 of the same law)
- after the donation was accepted did she make no effort to tell her bookkeeper to forward the illegal money to the head of the parliament (as an alternative to sending it back)
(25.4 same law)
https://www.bundestag.de/blob/189336...g_pdf-data.pdf


Anyone honestly believing the political opponents send them the money as a trap... well that's just stupid: the only logical reason why a highly educated financial professional does not react when the money arrives is that she knows the source. That's what the outrage is about: It reeks of corruption. So there are going to be a lot more laws which were broken besides the obvious ones we know right now.
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  #30  
Old 13.11.2018, 18:15
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Re: Zurich company illegally supports the European Right

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That simple bookkeeper informed her about the donation. She does not deny it but in fact confirmed it. She did not see it as her job to worry about it and told the bookkeeper to talk to the treasurer of the province.


Alice Weidel is not a simple bookkeeper, she is a member of parliament. Former Goldman Sachs, PhD in economy and a financial professional. If that little bookkeeper tells her "I got some Swiss dude sending us 9k every week and it amounts to 130k EUR by now" should all alarm bells go off. But they didn't.


Since you asked about rules broken:
- she accepted the donation and did not ask the bookkeeper to send it back immediately (25.2. of the linked law below)
- she did not inform her boss, the head of the parliament for receiving a donation over 50k. (25.3 of the same law)
- after the donation was accepted did she make no effort to tell her bookkeeper to forward the illegal money to the head of the parliament (as an alternative to sending it back)
(25.4 same law)
https://www.bundestag.de/blob/189336...g_pdf-data.pdf


Anyone honestly believing the political opponents send them the money as a trap... well that's just stupid: the only logical reason why a highly educated financial professional does not react when the money arrives is that she knows the source. That's what the outrage is about: It reeks of corruption. So there are going to be a lot more laws which were broken besides the obvious ones we know right now.
I dare to see things differently

<<Anyone honestly believing the political opponents send them the money as a trap... well that's just stupid>> anyone believing that someone honestly believes that, that's just ...... stupid maybe?
I still continue to refuse putting a fekking emoticon after each and every sentence I post on here.

Treverus got all the logical answers. ROFL.
Well, then, mods you can close the thread - problem solved. German authorities can turn to Treverus should they have additional questions.

Sandgrounder: I do apologize, apparently there IS an outrage. Or should you apologize to Loz? Gee, I lost track.



Treverus is so upset, he forgot all about his puffy English and actually proved, he knows the language after all.
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  #31  
Old 13.11.2018, 20:39
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Re: Zurich company illegally supports the European Right

Just for balance, the very interesting article below shows on how much of a shoe string the AfD are operating on compared to the more established parties. This 130k looks to me to be one of three possibilities:
  1. An honest error
  2. A smear job
  3. They really are that dumb and thought they could get away with it
DW exclusive: How German companies donate secret money to political parties
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  #32  
Old 13.11.2018, 21:11
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Re: Zurich company illegally supports the European Right

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Just for balance, the very interesting article below shows on how much of a shoe string the AfD are operating on compared to the more established parties. This 130k looks to me to be one of three possibilities:
  1. An honest error
  2. A smear job
  3. They really are that dumb and thought they could get away with it
DW exclusive: How German companies donate secret money to political parties
Thanks, that was interesting.


<< Since the last election year, 2013, all of Germany's major parties have received sums amounting to over 50,000 euros per year that have not come to light until much later – which means companies and wealthy individuals can easily hide any political influence>>
Normal procedure then
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  #33  
Old 13.11.2018, 21:27
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Re: Zurich company illegally supports the European Right

Time to legally support the rights of Europeans!

Tom
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  #34  
Old 13.11.2018, 21:51
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Re: Zurich company illegally supports the European Right

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I don't get the outrage here, the total amount is peanuts. It seems to be a growing trend at the moment, instead of arguing the points with these emerging populist parties, the establishment is going after them for accounting errors. Given that the AfD is a new party, it's not hard to see how these errors could occur.

Even if this was intended how far is 130k€ really going to go? Billions are spent by car lobbyist which result in terrible decisions being made like the support for diesel motors. Yet everyone is fine with that?

The risk of foreign interference is something that should be taken seriously, however 130k€ seems to me more like an clerical error. It's not worth the risk of getting caught, which they have been, for such a small amount of money.
I do not see how the amount is relevant?

In Germany 7,600 fare-dodgers were sent to jail in 2016 for avoiding paying very small amounts.

Source

Either it is an offence or it is not, it is no defense to a criminal offence to say "clerical error"!
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Old 13.11.2018, 22:04
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Re: Zurich company illegally supports the European Right

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I do not see how the amount is relevant?

In Germany 7,600 fare-dodgers were sent to jail in 2016 for avoiding paying very small amounts.

Source

Either it is an offence or it is not, it is no defense to a criminal offence to say "clerical error"!
Absolutely. But all parties.

Anyway, I do admit the only thing that really interests me is the Swiss involvement in this shit story and it annoys me that the Swiss authorities don't seem to give a hoot? (The Swiss media neither, at least not as far as I have seen).
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Old 13.11.2018, 22:07
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Re: Zurich company illegally supports the European Right

The European right to what exactly?

Tom
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  #37  
Old 13.11.2018, 22:14
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Re: Zurich company illegally supports the European Right

Odd celeb marketing strategy .. but he was an enthusiastic 'pharma' fiend
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  #38  
Old 13.11.2018, 22:25
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Re: Zurich company illegally supports the European Right

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The European right to what exactly?

Tom
Whom or what are you referring to?
Or are you taking the piss out of your post no. 33?

What right. Right. The EU with it's two-classes-system. They compete with the Indian caste system now?
Saw a report about Rumanian truck-drivers, driving for German companies. The new slaves.
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Old 13.11.2018, 22:26
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Re: Zurich company illegally supports the European Right

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Absolutely. But all parties.

Anyway, I do admit the only thing that really interests me is the Swiss involvement in this shit story and it annoys me that the Swiss authorities don't seem to give a hoot? (The Swiss media neither, at least not as far as I have seen).
Swiss media? From left to right!

https://www.nzz.ch/international/afd...eiz-ld.1436025

https://www.srf.ch/news/schweiz/spen...igt-afd-spende

https://www.20min.ch/schweiz/news/st...enst--18268493

https://www.blick.ch/news/wirtschaft...d15013623.html

https://www.handelszeitung.ch/politi...fd-unter-druck

https://www.tagesanzeiger.ch/ausland/europa/spendensegen-fuer-afd-ueber-zuercher-apotheker/story/17282328$$https://bazonline.ch/ausland/europa/...story/17282328
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Old 13.11.2018, 22:33
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Re: Zurich company illegally supports the European Right

I support the European Right to leave the EU!

Tom
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