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  #21  
Old 21.12.2019, 20:35
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Re: Switzerland switches off nuclear plant

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A roof should be a sun collector or not exist. Basta.
That would also cool down the last floor in summer
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  #22  
Old 21.12.2019, 21:00
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Re: Switzerland switches off nuclear plant

Go Nukes!

Tom
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  #23  
Old 21.12.2019, 23:17
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Re: Switzerland switches off nuclear plant

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I can well understand the NIMBY effect when you have a nuclear plant at the bottom of your garden, but this ageing plant should have been replaced with a new one.

Switzerland will import electricity as needed. From where? Germany is dropping all nuclear power and will rely on coal and Russian gas. Meanwhile France happily makes 70% of its output from nuclear. Letís hope hydro will get enough rainfall in the future to power electric vehicles, which will be the majority of cars on the road in less than 20 years.

PS solar panel installers will be happy at least...
Good point.
Actually I have seen little evidence of planning for electric cars here. Some estimates talk of a need to double electricity production and of billions needed to install the required infrastructure for charging; people talk about charging their cars overnight but who will line the streets and parking garages with power points?

It will need more than rain for hydro, Swiss rivers are sourced by glaciers and if global warming forecasts are correct then no glaciers, no rivers, no hydro.

There is a more positive Swiss report here that assumes water loss due to glaciers will mostly be balanced by building more water collection facilities.
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Old 21.12.2019, 23:22
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Re: Switzerland switches off nuclear plant

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That would also cool down the last floor in summer
They do?
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  #25  
Old 22.12.2019, 14:46
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Re: Switzerland switches off nuclear plant

Well, energy will get absorbed by the panels, and they will also shadow the roof...
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  #26  
Old 22.12.2019, 14:49
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Re: Switzerland switches off nuclear plant

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Well, energy will get absorbed by the panels, and they will also shadow the roof...
And help heat it!

Tom
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Old 22.12.2019, 14:57
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Re: Switzerland switches off nuclear plant

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i guess ms.sommaruga had different ideas..


"Transport and Energy Minister Simonetta Sommaruga tweeted that the future belonged to local, clean energy from the water and the sun"
Isnít that precisely what nuclear energy is ?
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Old 22.12.2019, 14:59
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Re: Switzerland switches off nuclear plant

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She's an idiot.

Tom
You only just realized ?
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  #29  
Old 23.12.2019, 10:01
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Re: Switzerland switches off nuclear plant

The only problem with that is:
Replacing both nuclear and fossil doesn't compute. Not even remotely. Not even with those pretty-painted "estimates".
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  #30  
Old 23.12.2019, 10:18
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Re: Switzerland switches off nuclear plant

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And help heat it!
A-ha, now I realize... in the typical layout they are embedded in the roof.

I was thinking more about suspending them. There are many examples of panel-covered parking areas along motorways, they both generate power and keep the cars in shadow:

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  #31  
Old 23.12.2019, 10:24
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Re: Switzerland switches off nuclear plant

Wonder why nobody heats with CNG gas? Plenty of it around. Even got the Infrastructure.

https://www.erdgas.info/energie/erdgas-im-haushalt/
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  #32  
Old 23.12.2019, 11:14
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Re: Switzerland switches off nuclear plant

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Wonder why nobody heats with CNG gas? Plenty of it around. Even got the Infrastructure.

https://www.erdgas.info/energie/erdgas-im-haushalt/
Nobody?

May landlord heats about 18 flats with it. Huge, ugly tank where the garages are. Funny enough, after a few months one doesn't notice it anymore.
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  #33  
Old 23.12.2019, 11:34
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Re: Switzerland switches off nuclear plant

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I've said it for years: There should be solar pannels on absolutely every roof in Switzerland - rented and run by the EKZ (and equivalent) for those who don't want to bother themselves. Looks like admin.ch is slowly catching up to this idea.

We have two wonderfully huge roofs here to do so and I keep nagging my landlord about it. She claimed we would not be allowed to do that here. When you approach our hamlet now, you can see huge solar panneled roofs. Of the neighbours.

A roof should be a sun collector or not exist. Basta.
just a shame the swiss energy companies actively discourage people from doing it, paying far less per unit then they charge for example
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  #34  
Old 23.12.2019, 12:18
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Re: Switzerland switches off nuclear plant

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It was just about time. Good news!
Why is that?

I like being warm at home during wintertime and without the smog one can see e.g. in China
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  #35  
Old 23.12.2019, 15:32
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Re: Switzerland switches off nuclear plant

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Meanwhile France happily makes 70% of its output from nuclear...
Thatís just typical. They need to stop overreacting.
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  #36  
Old 23.12.2019, 15:58
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Re: Switzerland switches off nuclear plant

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Wonder why nobody heats with CNG gas? Plenty of it around. Even got the Infrastructure.
In Italy this is the standard. Natural gas was discovered in the late '50 and in the '60 the state oil & gas company started to lay pipes across the peninsula. Nowadays only a minority of the population is not connected to the methane network.
It took decades and a lot of work to lay down 41.000 km of pipes, but that meant less oil imports, so I guess it was a saving after all (the strategy started when pollution was not yet considered such an issue).
It's also standard to cook with gas coming from the network, and only induction is really getting the people's interest. Ceramic stoves do not exists.

We used to say that in France and other countries gas is almost not used at all exactly because of the energy strategy being nuclear-focused. Italy has no nuclear, although it was tried in the past.

Last edited by venetian; 23.12.2019 at 16:25.
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  #37  
Old 23.12.2019, 16:00
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Re: Switzerland switches off nuclear plant

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Germany is dropping all nuclear power and will rely on coal and Russian gas.
...and importing from neighboring countries generating power... from nuclear

Germans are really good at being hypocrites sometimes
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  #38  
Old 23.12.2019, 16:12
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Re: Switzerland switches off nuclear plant

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...and importing from neighboring countries generating power... from nuclear

Germans are really good at being hypocrites sometimes
And off-shore windparks, afaIk.

Once skiing is definitely out, one can do slalom-sailing there.
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  #39  
Old 24.12.2019, 11:28
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Re: Switzerland switches off nuclear plant

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Why is that?

I like being warm at home during wintertime and without the smog one can see e.g. in China
As a power electronics engineer, I strongly believe in power generation and conversion sector based on renewable energy sources, which currently are catching up with nuclear power plants. As an example:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/rrapier...power-in-2018/

I’m not saying there is no place for nuclear power plants but they have to be developed based on modern technologies with minimum carbon emission. Thus, old ones must undergo a process of decommissioning. Radioactive waste disposal is another hot topic. Ideally, an efficient smart grid is what would be a healthy combination which equally utilizes all energy sources.



The modern technology should look into cleaner thorium reactors instead of old, uranium reactors which were politically triggered by nuclear race of the past. You will also see much less risk posed by the former if it gets in hands of undesired extremist groups.
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Old 25.12.2019, 10:34
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Re: Switzerland switches off nuclear plant

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Go Nukes!

Tom
Rather split wood than atoms.
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