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  #181  
Old 17.09.2020, 16:42
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Re: CH - EU agreemeent on immigration at stake.

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I learnt Italian from TV, and my German/SG went from grap to good when I moved to TI, as I often dealt with SG clients.

Tom
It is claimed most Italians also learned their language from TV, before that they all spoke different incompatible dialects.

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In 1950, just as the country was going through a time of complete infrastructural, economic, social and politic reconstruction, less than 20% of the Italian population spoke Italian fluently in their day to day to life.

TV programs began to be broadcast by RAI, the state broadcaster, in 1954 on just one channel. In the years that followed, up until the economic boom between 1958 and 1962, television did not just become a way to bring people together (as very few people actually had a TV set), but also a way to broadcast cultural programs and linguistic models.
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  #182  
Old 17.09.2020, 16:44
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Re: CH - EU agreemeent on immigration at stake.

Certainly the case in Sicily still - the Montalbano series even is subtitled in Italian.
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  #183  
Old 17.09.2020, 16:46
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Re: CH - EU agreemeent on immigration at stake.

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Frontaliers do pay taxes in Switzerland, just like the residents.

In Geneva only.
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  #184  
Old 17.09.2020, 17:09
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Re: CH - EU agreemeent on immigration at stake.

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Don't forget Tommaso votes for his wife and I'm guessing for his daughters too....
My two Kittens, dutch born, also voted Meeeonoonnnn ...
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  #185  
Old 17.09.2020, 17:17
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Re: CH - EU agreemeent on immigration at stake.

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In Geneva only.
In Vaud and Neuchatel frontaliers pay tax in France and a small amount is rebated to Switzerland.
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  #186  
Old 17.09.2020, 17:35
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Re: CH - EU agreemeent on immigration at stake.

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In Vaud and Neuchatel frontaliers pay tax in France and a small amount is rebated to Switzerland.
Frontaliers from Germany pay 4.5% tax in Switzerland.
https://www.sv.fin.be.ch/sv_fin/de/i...nzgaenger.html

With Italy the current rule is AFAIK that 70% of the income is taxed on the Swiss side and 30% is taxed on the Italian side.
https://www.swissinfo.ch/ger/neues-s...kaden/41993936

With France it depends on the canton. In case of Bern, France levies the tax and gives 4.5% (of the gross income) back to the canton Bern
https://www.sv.fin.be.ch/sv_fin/de/i...nzgaenger.html
In case of Geneva, Geneva levies the tax and gives something to France
https://www.pwc.ch/de/insights/steue...ankreich1.html
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  #187  
Old 17.09.2020, 17:36
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Re: CH - EU agreemeent on immigration at stake.

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It is claimed most Italians also learned their language from TV, before that they all spoke different incompatible dialects.



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I've got a friend in his late 30s / early 40s who has a grandmother in her late 90s from Piedemont who has lived in South London since the 1950s, who has "forgotten" how to speak English and then Italian and only speaks Piedemontese.
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  #188  
Old 17.09.2020, 19:37
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Re: CH - EU agreemeent on immigration at stake.

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With Italy the current rule is AFAIK that 70% of the income is taxed on the Swiss side and 30% is taxed on the Italian side.
No.

100% is taxed in CH, unless they live more than 20km from the border, in which case it is taxed in Italy.

However, 70% (of the Swiss tax) is kicked back to Italy (they want to reduce this).

Tom
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  #189  
Old 17.09.2020, 19:43
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Re: CH - EU agreemeent on immigration at stake.

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It is claimed most Italians also learned their language from TV, before that they all spoke different incompatible dialects.
Same as Italian and German in Switzerland, then.

I was once with a bunch of TI coworkers in Sweden, and we got fed up with Swedish food and asked to use the company kitchen. I did the appetizer and main, others did the pasta and dessert.

I noticed them speaking Italian to each other (French to me) and asked why, as they were all Ticinese.

"we don't understand each other's dialects, so we speak Italian!"

Elder Ticinsese have learned to understand the others' dialects, so each speaks his own, but with younger people it doesn't work.

Tom
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  #190  
Old 17.09.2020, 19:52
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Re: CH - EU agreemeent on immigration at stake.

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Same as Italian and German in Switzerland, then.

I was once with a bunch of TI coworkers in Sweden, and we got fed up with Swedish food and asked to use the company kitchen. I did the appetizer and main, others did the pasta and dessert.

I noticed them speaking Italian to each other (French to me) and asked why, as they were all Ticinese.

"we don't understand each other's dialects, so we speak Italian!"

Elder Ticinsese have learned to understand the others' dialects, so each speaks his own, but with younger people it doesn't work.

Tom
I think it's a question of generations. My Italian friend doesn't speak her parents' dialect because they never wanted her and her sibling to learn it. It was their "codified" language , they thought it will drag them down at school etc. They speak a dialect from Veneto. I wonder how different is from the "literary"/official Italian? As far as I know the official dialect is the one from Toscana, am I right?
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  #191  
Old 17.09.2020, 20:22
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Re: CH - EU agreemeent on immigration at stake.

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I think it's a question of generations. My Italian friend doesn't speak her parents' dialect because they never wanted her and her sibling to learn it. It was their "codified" language , they thought it will drag them down at school etc. They speak a dialect from Veneto. I wonder how different is from the "literary"/official Italian? As far as I know the official dialect is the one from Toscana, am I right?
More or less, and yes, I know several Ticinese who never learned it at home for the reasons that you said.

However, unlike Swiss-German, most learn Ticinese (which is basically standard Lombardian/Insubrian, even the woman at the B&B near Domodossola last weekend recognized that we spoke the same) only as adults, and they only speak standard Italian in schools.

First time I heard Triestine I was horrified!

Tom
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  #192  
Old 18.09.2020, 15:21
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Re: CH - EU agreemeent on immigration at stake.

Just had this ad pop up

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  #193  
Old 18.09.2020, 15:43
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Re: CH - EU agreemeent on immigration at stake.

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Just had this ad pop up

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The EU flag has 12 stars. What the SVP has against Kosovo?
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  #194  
Old 21.09.2020, 11:25
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Re: CH - EU agreemeent on immigration at stake.

Opinion poll for the referendum on the anti-immigration initiative (last week). 35% YES, 63% NO, 2% don't know yet. https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/anti-eu...s-say/46034096
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  #195  
Old 21.09.2020, 11:40
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Re: CH - EU agreemeent on immigration at stake.

Big question:

In 2013 there were a total of 1,937,447 permanent residents (23.8% of the total population of 8.14 million) in Switzerland.

This is switzerland.

If we go to Geneva, Zurich and Zug probably 40% is not far from reality. So soon foreigners pay more taxes than Swiss.

Is this the real concern?

From 2006:
https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/almost-...20since%201995.

in 30 years, 20% to 33% in Zurich.

I would say it doubled from 2011 to 2020.

Is it a problem having more than 50& non swiss?
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  #196  
Old 21.09.2020, 11:58
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Re: CH - EU agreemeent on immigration at stake.

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B

If we go to Geneva, Zurich and Zug probably 40% is not far from reality. So soon foreigners pay more taxes than Swiss.
(B + C) / (Swiss + B +C) * 100%

GE: 36.4 %
ZH: 26.5 %
ZG: 27.8 %
https://www.pxweb.bfs.admin.ch/pxweb...3-1532f5f3436f

I am not aware about a statistic which would show tax paid vs permit/Swiss. If you are talking about taxation w/o representation: Many of those with permit C can apply for naturalization.
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  #197  
Old 21.09.2020, 14:05
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Re: CH - EU agreemeent on immigration at stake.

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So soon foreigners pay more taxes than Swiss.
Those with an L permit pay taxes too. In many cases the L permit is a step towards a B. Because of the existing quotas for non-EU or lesser-EU (lol), not everyone is/was so lucky to get a B permit right from the start, despite having permanent work contracts etc.
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  #198  
Old 27.09.2020, 13:26
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Re: CH - EU agreemeent on immigration at stake.

Looking very good for the vote atm. Tagi estimating a near 62% no result.
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  #199  
Old 27.09.2020, 13:50
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Re: CH - EU agreemeent on immigration at stake.

My wife is a scrutineer, turnout here was over 75%, exceptionally high.
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  #200  
Old 27.09.2020, 13:53
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Re: CH - EU agreemeent on immigration at stake.

Only three cantons reporting in, so far.

https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/politic...&utm_content=o
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