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  #401  
Old 09.03.2021, 09:32
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Re: Vote 7th March 2021

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Communism (or whatever pretense philosophy dictatorial regimes hide behind) supports negation of basic human rights, in a gender non discriminatory way. Progress? Really? The stuff that people say sometimes...
So you're saying....? lol

I won't post oversized pictures to make my point btw.

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FTFY!

Tom
Yeah, you're right. Colour doesn't matter. But white is seriously aggravating the situ. Power of the visual impact and all that.

(I suppose worse could be only yellow or red )
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  #402  
Old 09.03.2021, 09:46
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Re: Vote 7th March 2021

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I believe ‘they’ is the pronoun of choice for referring to a person in a gender neutral way.
Referring to a human being as ‘it’ is not very nice in my opinion.
But "they" is plural of "it"!

Tom
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  #403  
Old 09.03.2021, 10:07
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Re: Vote 7th March 2021

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But "they" is plural of "it"!

Tom
It is also the singular pronoun used to refer to people in a gender neutral way as I’m sure you know.
Referring to a person as ‘it’ is just rude.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/They
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  #404  
Old 09.03.2021, 10:15
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Re: Vote 7th March 2021

I think I get what AntePortas means. The diaspora is important because the people that go abroad enjoy higher status at home, and the children of people staying at home look at the uncles and aunts as aspirational figures. If parents are regularly ignored by teenagers, now imagine the competition between mom with burka or relatively wealthy and relatively less oppressed aunt.
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  #405  
Old 09.03.2021, 10:21
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Re: Vote 7th March 2021

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Referring to a person as ‘it’ is just rude.
At least it is gramatically correct usage, unlike 'they'.

Tom
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  #406  
Old 09.03.2021, 10:33
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Re: Vote 7th March 2021

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I think I get what AntePortas means. The diaspora is important because the people that go abroad enjoy higher status at home, and the children of people staying at home look at the uncles and aunts as aspirational figures. If parents are regularly ignored by teenagers, now imagine the competition between mom with burka or relatively wealthy and relatively less oppressed aunt.
Exactly. And the larger diaspora the larger influence it is. When I came first time to Kosovo in 2001 I expected men in traditional clothes and women with scarfs. It was summer and all so called "Schatzi" were there visiting from Germany,Swiss,Austria... Uncovered pierced belly button on some girl in shorts or skirt was so common. My translator explained those are 2nd gen diaspora and that this was impossible sight just few years ago.
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  #407  
Old 09.03.2021, 10:40
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Re: Vote 7th March 2021

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Exactly. And the larger diaspora the larger influence it is. When I came first time to Kosovo in 2001 I expected men in traditional clothes and women with scarfs. It was summer and all so called "Schatzi" were there visiting from Germany,Swiss,Austria... Uncovered pierced belly button on some girl in shorts or skirt was so common. My translator explained those are 2nd gen diaspora and that this was impossible sight just few years ago.
That's interesting. No sixties/seventies "revolution" there? Then they were much more conservative even for the region.
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  #408  
Old 09.03.2021, 10:45
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Re: Vote 7th March 2021

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At least it is gramatically correct usage, unlike 'they'.

Tom
The non binary use of the pronoun ‘they’ in the singular may be a new concept but ‘they’ has been used as a singular pronoun for centuries and is grammatically correct usage.

https://public.oed.com/blog/a-brief-...singular-they/

https://www.merriam-webster.com/word...nonbinary-they
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  #409  
Old 09.03.2021, 10:51
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Re: Vote 7th March 2021

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Important to not overlook the fact that the burka is extreme even in Islam
It's extremely common in parts of Pakistan and in Afghanistan. It's the norm and not extreme in some areas.
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  #410  
Old 09.03.2021, 10:56
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Re: Vote 7th March 2021

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The non binary use of the pronoun ‘they’ in the singular may be a new concept but ‘they’ has been used as a singular pronoun for centuries and is grammatically correct usage.

https://public.oed.com/blog/a-brief-...singular-they/

https://www.merriam-webster.com/word...nonbinary-they
Out of curiosity, may I ask you to make a sentence with singular they ?

"Every wikipedia user should know how they cite the website properly?"
The construction seems odd. (Yes I know, better replace they with to)
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  #411  
Old 09.03.2021, 10:57
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Re: Vote 7th March 2021

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That's interesting. No sixties/seventies "revolution" there? Then they were much more conservative even for the region.
Yes no 60ties 70ties revolution there. It happened in most of the ex Yugoslavia but not in Albanian areas. Regime was rather oppressive towards them then. They were always iredentists separatists etc and somehow excluded from the rest of the country due to language and traditionalist views.
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  #412  
Old 09.03.2021, 11:10
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Re: Vote 7th March 2021

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Out of curiosity, may I ask you to make a sentence with singular they ?

"Every wikipedia user should know how they cite the website properly?"
The construction seems odd. (Yes I know, better replace they with to)
Have you seen Tony? They have/(S)he has a new car. (Possibly grammatically incorrect but in semi common usage).

Every wikipedia user should know how they can cite the website properly
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  #413  
Old 09.03.2021, 11:12
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Re: Vote 7th March 2021

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Out of curiosity, may I ask you to make a sentence with singular they ?

"Every wikipedia user should know how they cite the website properly?"
The construction seems odd. (Yes I know, better replace they with to)
Yes, definitely better to use to in that sentence.


They caretaker decided that they should clean the floors a day earlier than planned due to the inclement weather.

Caretaker being a title applicable to both men and women the gender neutral pronoun ‘they’ can be used.
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  #414  
Old 09.03.2021, 11:33
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Re: Vote 7th March 2021

I think TTYO had no intention to be rude. But to signal that he had no idea who was under the clothes, made his gentleman manners hard to apply. "It" may be the consequence. It is a bit like holding the door open I guess. Risky.
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  #415  
Old 09.03.2021, 11:37
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Re: Vote 7th March 2021

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I think TTYO had no intention to be rude.
I don’t think he had the intention to be rude either.
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Old 09.03.2021, 11:41
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Re: Vote 7th March 2021

Joe would like to take the day off, but they has to go to work.

As 'they' is singular here, so the verb conjugation should be as well.

Tom
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  #417  
Old 09.03.2021, 11:56
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Re: Vote 7th March 2021

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Joe would like to take the day off, but they has to go to work.

As 'they' is singular here, so the verb conjugation should be as well.

Tom
Now you’re just being ridiculous.

By that logic depending on if it was used as a singular or plural pronoun ‘you’ should be conjugated differently too.
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  #418  
Old 09.03.2021, 12:12
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Re: Vote 7th March 2021

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Joe would like to take the day off, but they has to go to work.

As 'they' is singular here, so the verb conjugation should be as well.

Tom
Weren't there some suggestions for brand new, gender neutral personal pronouns? Putting things to plural because the gender isn't evident is not logical.
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  #419  
Old 09.03.2021, 12:56
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Re: Vote 7th March 2021

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Weren't there some suggestions for brand new, gender neutral personal pronouns? Putting things to plural because the gender isn't evident is not logical.
It has been so for centuries, it’s not a new thing.

They has been used as a singular pronoun since at least the 1300s where the gender wasn’t evident or important. It’s not as though we’ve suddenly randomly decided to use it in this way.
Likewise you was a plural pronoun which was later used as a singular and eventually replaced the previously commonly used singular pronouns.

Language evolves and not always logically.

‘They’ as a singular pronoun and the history of it is actually a really cool thing to discuss with students.
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Old 09.03.2021, 13:35
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Re: Vote 7th March 2021

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They caretaker decided that they should clean the floors a day earlier than planned due to the inclement weather.

Caretaker being a title applicable to both men and women the gender neutral pronoun ‘they’ can be used.
The first they is a typo right? Thank you for your examples Belgianmum and Ato
I vaguely remember sentences like that. I always translated that to the caretaker planing to involve his or her team into the cleaning process.

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Weren't there some suggestions for brand new, gender neutral personal pronouns? Putting things to plural because the gender isn't evident is not logical.
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It has been so for centuries, it’s not a new thing.

(...)
MC was most likely referring to some years ago when US unis decided it was a good idea to come up with fancy new pronouns and force them onto students and teachers

https://www.su.ualberta.ca/services/...earn/pronouns/

That was the moment for Jordan Petersons 15 min of fame
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