Berlusconi, yes.

Trump, no.

Tom

Its rather hard to find a difference between those 2 arrogant self-centered corrupted a-holes... but you have your right to a preference for sure. What about Putin? He is actually much smarter than those 2 (even combined), even if all 3 are some form of highly-functioning-sociopaths.

That is the single truly scary bit of the current situation: Putin was always a stone cold sociopath but as you said a very very smart one - so in his own way very logical and therefore predictable. The current war makes absolutely no sense at all... so either he is losing it (which is a very scare thought) or he is surrounded by some really bad advisors and deciding in a bubble of fake news (not a much better thought...).

Well. He won't lose the war as long as China supports him. One way or another.

That doesn't fit OP's view.

…or even China calling Russia a Chief Strategic Partner

Putin is also good friends with a few of Lugano's elected officials!!

is, or was?

cannon fodder is also strategic

Well, we clearly disagree, but somehow both manage to do so in a friendly and respectful way. Which I think is different from how Chuff and Hausamsee have treated the OP. Simple as that. One thing I find remarkable about this conflict is the tribal behaviour it shows... people have very little balanced discussions, the world is separated in good and evil and everyone who is not openly pledging to be a friend is a foe. Which is sort of the topic of this thread...

That's rich.

Communists do have a funny narrative and language. (wooden, sorry, iron language)

Couldn't stop laughing. I bet Ukraine and Russia were two friendly iron clads during USSR.
In reality China, like everyone else, follows its own interest.
Of course they will continue to be strategic partners because

So there.

From the URL Chuff posted in the beginning of this thread, I got an impression that Switzerland is not as much joining the sanctions, as just imitating this activity. Quite a typical thing, I would say.

The only real "sanction" I see was stopping the flights, but it may be just a logistics and safety measure, in order to avoid unpredictable and hardly controllable transit in the very middle of Europe.
Blocking assets for Lavrov, Putin and few more? Don't make me laugh.

Having no assets abroad was a strict requirement for top Russian government officials since at least a decade.

I'm sure it's the same in China. Makes sense to me, may be an interesting topic for discussion...

"We block the assets... no matter if they exist" ))
Any other Swiss sanctions I overlooked?

Yes, plenty. Switzerland has basically taken over the entire package of the EU sanctions. We are not talking about a list of a few oligarchs, but blocking trade pretty widely... today the Swiss watch manufacturers announced they will close their shops as the export of watches to Russia has stopped already.
Any sort of banking is pretty much banned by now, not just oligarchs but anyone, any company or any organization in Russia trying to have over 100k cash in Switzerland. There are plenty of expats working in the oil sector there. The ones who dont happen to have an EU passport are pretty much screwed now.
McDonalds is closing their over 800 restaurants... because they cant import their food anymore. Anyone who has done business with Russia knows just how integrated their economy is into global trade... sure, there are some VW factories there. But they assemble parts coming from around the world and would not be able even in the mid term to build a car from scratch on their own... these sanctions bomb Russia back into the cold war economy where stuff just isnt available. And pretty quickly so for a lot of goods. The factories will have to close and people will lose their jobs.

Switzerland will lose out on anything from exporting watches to cheese... but simply could not stay out this time around - the trade with the EU is too valuable.

I dont know why people keep on bringing up China but very simply put: What the west is doing to Russia right now would never ever work with China... because the same sort of sanctions would easily hurt us more than it would hurt China. So I am afraid that in a similar situation, say about Taiwan... economic measures wont work and the military option might be the one the Western powers would have to pick.

My understanding of trade blocking is slightly different, I can't imagine how watch and cheese restrictions can affect the economy.


Can you name any *real* Swiss industry sectors that have joined the sanctions?

I see only Swiss banking that may make some harm. But official documents are very accurately worded, so one can read between the lines that Swiss are only *thinking* about implementing any restrictions in the bank sector.


Yes, individual banks have individually adjusted some poliicies again. The exact changes, however, are under strict non-disclosure.




That's information from tabloids, not from Swiss government nor from the bank customers.


Mentioning McDonals restaurants as an economic sanction is the same "tabloid" approach. It's rather a favor than a harm - a I'm pretty sure these restaurants will soon reopen under local or Asian brand.

I can only tell the multinational I work for has _00 employees in Russia doing the countdown to the end of their employment contracts. Hope Putin's friends pay better than weak and morally decaying Western capitalists

Remember this is about business. My employer happily made a press release yesterday about how less than 1% of the company revenue comes from Russia so "we" start the process to terminate business there. Other business in similar situations are making all the noise you see in media around the world.

The irony here is that the companies that will be impacted the most are the silent ones. Who's the brave one to tell investors a significant part of revenue is tied to Russian business?

About real business joining willingly/unwillingly to the sanctions, there's the Mediterranean Shipping Company (MSC) headquartered in Geneva:

https://www.msc.com/che/notices/2022...to-from-russia

This is from Philip Morris International annual report 2020 .PMI had a third of the Russian market share on 2020. PMI sales in Russia are equivalent to Germany + Italy PMI sales. About 10% of cigarettes and vaporizer liquid of global PMI production was sold on Russia on 2020. Russia is 17% percent of PMI vaporizer liquid global sales.



Of course, the public stance of the Swiss business association (economiesuisse) is:

https://www.economiesuisse.ch/en/art...against-russia

Who's going to be the idiot to accept damage publicly and cause an equity selloff? I need to work, but if you dig, you find

Thanks an interesting and unbiased viewpoint, Axa.

However, I'd still not mix up the damage from MSC (which may be noticeable indeed) with the ban of PMI, which for me, as non-smoker, sounds like good news ))

My perspective is revenue, ultimately money.

Since PMI is a large employer in Switzerland, I'd expect some jobs being cut when 10% of their global sales are compromised. PMI has been one of the companies that have said nothing yet, so speculation for now.

About PMI Russia, they have 4'100 employees whose life will change soon. Whatever your opinion of tobacco is, these 4'100 households had comfy middle-class lives. The minimal change I can see is the company being acquired by local investors. Don't know if it's still possible to export tobacco to Russia under the sanctions, far from my areas of expertise https://www.pmi.com/markets/russia/en/overview

I dont need to read tabloids to get the news on how the sanctions impact the banks... I know quite a few people who racked up lots of overtime the last two weeks trying to sort out what their bank is still allowed to do and what not. The seco documents are a pretty exact copy of the EU ones, just adding "Swiss" next to EU nationals, CHF next to EUR... but not clarifying the many detail questions. Large teams of lawyers at all banks are trying to come to conclusions what the sanctions mean for each and every sort of transaction imaginable... I know for fact that Russian clients by now have a very hard time to get money in, out or do anything with their existing portfolios. None of the banks dares to be the one who breaks the sanction in any way... so in doubt rather says "no".

My gut feeling tells me that if only one bank will somehow screw it up its probably CS... they have a bit of a run with that sort of thing lately...

Doesn't sound like something new to me.
Clients from "high risk countries" without Swiss residence permit always had difficulties with Swiss portfolios, as the banks were adjusting the relevant policies several times a year. Swiss bank account without Swiss residence isn't a cheap thing since many years, so the clients who can afford it these days, obviously don't put all eggs in one basket, and can wait till the wave goes down.

This posts makes it clear that you have honestly not the slightest clue of whats going on. Since you are so stuck up about sources... Here you go: thats the official sanction law issued by Switzerland last Friday. Have fun reading it... I can assure you its not business as usual. https://www.fedlex.admin.ch/eli/cc/2022/151/de

OMG, they want to asphyxiate the Russian oil industry: no leased oil rigs, no insurance for expensive stuff, no machines, no replacement parts, no engineering services, no oil trading, no oil import from Russia

I'm wondering now if the sanctions from other countries go in the same direction. If so, Russia is going Venezuela's way where the dictator can stay in power as long as desired but not much else.