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-   -   Atheist bus campaign in CH (https://www.englishforum.ch/swiss-politics-news/43755-atheist-bus-campaign-ch.html)

Macchiato 17.02.2009 17:51

Atheist bus campaign in CH
 
Hi free thinkers,
Happy to see the bus is here as well:

http://www.swissinfo.org/eng/front/A...83340000&ty=st

Here is the website :
http://geniess-das-leben.ch/

which you can donate to reach the target (I will do myself soon).

ENJOY your LIFE ;):)

InShan 17.02.2009 18:49

Re: Atheist bus campaign in CH
 
I don't understand the point of this. If someone wants to blow a truckload of money advertising God (which is hilarious incidentally), let them.

However, most atheists I know claim to have come to atheism through rationality- "I know God doesn't exist because there is no evidence supporting his existence, and much evidence showing traditional god stories to be untrue". If rationality is the backdrop to atheism, surely atheists can see there are much better, more urgent causes to give money to, than sniping to the bible-koran-talmud-gita thumpers via public transport means?

Just my two cents.

Macchiato 17.02.2009 19:26

Re: Atheist bus campaign in CH
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by InShan (Post 398868)
I don't understand the point of this. If someone wants to blow a truckload of money advertising God (which is hilarious incidentally), let them.

However, most atheists I know claim to have come to atheism through rationality- "I know God doesn't exist because there is no evidence supporting his existence, and much evidence showing traditional god stories to be untrue". If rationality is the backdrop to atheism, surely atheists can see there are much better, more urgent causes to give money to, than sniping to the bible-koran-talmud-gita thumpers via public transport means?

Just my two cents.

At least, the glance, may give a chance for some non-atheists to think more rationally about god's existence than just accepting it as a default de-facto belief that doesn need to be thought on!
And to atheists, at least a smile:p

Anyway your story can be told, to all religous banners hanging here and there as well.

Guest 17.02.2009 19:32

Re: Atheist bus campaign in CH
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Macchiato (Post 398890)
At least, the glance, may give a chance for some non-atheists to think more rationally about god's existence

Why?

Christians, Muslims, Jews and other believers in God in Switzerland are hardly making our lives difficult, are they?

You might have a point if these buses were being driven round Mecca, Jerusalem, Rome or Salt Lake City, but round Switzerland?

Hilarious...

Guest 17.02.2009 19:33

Re: Atheist bus campaign in CH
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Macchiato (Post 398890)
Anyway your story can be told, to all religous banners hanging here and there as well.

Nobody's inviting me to subsidise any of these. If religious people want to advertise themselves, then let them.

I'm not paying a penny for a useless cause that claims to speak in my name.

Boy Wonder 17.02.2009 19:37

Re: Atheist bus campaign in CH
 
Quote:

Why?

Christians, Muslims, Jews and other believers in God in Switzerland are hardly making our lives difficult, are they?
Well, the churches have a tendency of waking me up too early in the weekends with all their noise. Funny, that - it's not allowed for me to make any noise on Sundays.

Macchiato 17.02.2009 20:20

Re: Atheist bus campaign in CH
 
Quote:

Why?

Christians, Muslims, Jews and other believers in God in Switzerland are hardly making our lives difficult, are they?

You might have a point if these buses were being driven round Mecca, Jerusalem, Rome or Salt Lake City, but round Switzerland?

Hilarious...
If it takes a few weeks for the bus to reach to CH from UK, we could expect whitin a few years it can reah those stations!:msncool:
Let the bus run land by land.

Guest 17.02.2009 20:28

Re: Atheist bus campaign in CH
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Macchiato (Post 398917)
we could expect whitin a few years it can reah those stations!:msncool:

I very much doubt the organisers would have the balls, quite honestly.

Better play safe and preach to the unconverted, eh?

InShan 17.02.2009 20:40

Re: Atheist bus campaign in CH
 
Quote:

I very much doubt the organisers would have the balls, quite honestly.

Better play safe and preach to the unconverted, eh?

As Dougal said- I very much doubt that they would have the courage to go to a place which didn't permit religious pluralism and freedom of expression.

Switzerland is an easy target. Yes, its a primarily Christian country, but nevertheless- the freedoms which allow these buses to run around insulting the view of the larger part of society are entrenched deep. I wonder if you'd feel like driving that bus through the streets of Downtown Karachi, or Jerusalem? Or wearing a t-shirt proclaiming the same message? T-shirt would be cheaper, and a hell of a lot more mobile- so you should think about it.

I find smug, self-satisfied atheism to be as dangerous a beast as smug, self-satisfied religion (of whatever flavour). If you really want to win people over to your cause, try logic and respect for their intelligence instead of gimmicks.

Macchiato 17.02.2009 20:51

Re: Atheist bus campaign in CH
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by InShan (Post 398929)
I very much doubt that they would have the courage to go to a place which didn't permit religious pluralism and freedom of expression.

I wonder if you'd feel like driving that bus through the streets of Downtown Karachi, or Jerusalem? .

I know it won't happen in our lifetime (my dream will be to see the bus in those cities), but it will reach one day, so let the wheels run, better slow than nothing.

Boy Wonder 17.02.2009 20:52

Re: Atheist bus campaign in CH
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by InShan (Post 398929)
Switzerland is an easy target. Yes, its a primarily Christian country, but nevertheless- the freedoms which allow these buses to run around insulting the view of the larger part of society are entrenched deep. I wonder if you'd feel like driving that bus through the streets of Downtown Karachi, or Jerusalem? Or wearing a t-shirt proclaiming the same message? T-shirt would be cheaper, and a hell of a lot more mobile- so you should think about it.

I've wondered about that - are people religious in CH? Or is it like back home where you're automatically a church member from the day you're borne and need to take active steps in order to exit. Most don't leave, but they don't attend church either, so then the question is if they're religious or not. Clearly, church attendance per se is not a measure of spirituality, but it does make me wonder.

Quote:

Originally Posted by InShan (Post 398929)
I find smug, self-satisfied atheism to be as dangerous a beast as smug, self-satisfied religion (of whatever flavour). If you really want to win people over to your cause, try logic and respect for their intelligence instead of gimmicks.

No point trying to use logic - faith isn't based on logic. Besides, why bother - as long as they don't bother you or try to teach your kids about ID rather than evolution in school.

Guest 17.02.2009 20:53

Re: Atheist bus campaign in CH
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Macchiato (Post 398938)
I know it won't happen in our lifetime

Why don't you make it happen?

Boy Wonder 17.02.2009 20:56

Re: Atheist bus campaign in CH
 
Btw, does anyone else have these moments where you realize the extent of how your protestant upbringing has shaped you in terms of work ethics and that gnawing sense of guilt? Or is it just me having too much time on my hands to ponder how I "feel" all the time (probably because I don't work hard enough...)?

Guest 17.02.2009 20:56

Re: Atheist bus campaign in CH
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Boy Wonder (Post 398941)
why bother

Indeed.

So some people believe stuff that we think is silly. And?

As long as they're happy to let us disbelieve in their various gods (which, in Switzerland, they are), shouldn't we give them the same respect in return?

And even if they (oh, the horror!) put advertisements on buses threatening us with fiery doom and annihilation, shouldn't we just ignore them and continue with our lives as normal?

InShan 17.02.2009 20:58

Re: Atheist bus campaign in CH
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Boy Wonder (Post 398941)
No point trying to use logic - faith isn't based on logic. Besides, why bother - as long as they don't bother you or try to teach your kids about ID rather than evolution in school.

Faith isn't based on logic, but most proponents of Atheism argue that their belief system is based on logic. I don't believe in God actively. I don't disbelieve in God actively. I don't care all that much- going along with it makes my family happy, when they're around. Ignoring it makes me happy when they're not around.

But if you claim your faith system is better than another person's (shining the light on the uncivilized masses that just follow like sheep!) because of the logic and reason inherent- then go on. Convince me. You might be able to. An anonymous, provocative and rude message on a Bus won't.

Guest 17.02.2009 20:59

Re: Atheist bus campaign in CH
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Boy Wonder (Post 398943)
Btw, does anyone else have these moments where you realize the extent of how your protestant upbringing has shaped you in terms of work ethics and that gnawing sense of guilt? Or is it just me having too much time on my hands to ponder how I "feel" all the time (probably because I don't work hard enough...)?

Nah. When I lost my belief, I lost pretty much all the baggage, too.

Which was nice.

I can understand why it isn't so easy for some people, though. I had a pretty chilled upbringing without the benefit of whippings, bible-readings and cold showers.

If I'd been brought up by monks I might have a different outlook.

InShan 17.02.2009 21:02

Re: Atheist bus campaign in CH
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Macchiato (Post 398938)
I know it won't happen in our lifetime (my dream will be to see the bus in those cities), but it will reach one day, so let the wheels run, better slow than nothing.

The Bus might not. A t-shirt can. You can be the first martyr in the name of Atheism. I'll get the t-shirt printed, if you'll wear it. A day around Vatican city. That's nice and close.

I think that's what bothers me so much about this. Its just ... mean spirited. Believe whatever you want, but if you need to insult someone elses' faith to justify your own- atleast have the courage to not do it anonymously.

Macchiato 17.02.2009 21:10

Re: Atheist bus campaign in CH
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by InShan (Post 398953)
The Bus might not. A t-shirt can. You can be the first martyr in the name of Atheism. I'll get the t-shirt printed, if you'll wear it. A day around Vatican city. That's nice and close.

I think that's what bothers me so much about this. Its just ... mean spirited. Believe whatever you want, but if you need to insult someone elses' faith to justify your own- atleast have the courage to not do it anonymously.

Wait a min.
If Saying "probably god doesn't exist" is an insult to other's beilef, then all religious words written and told in history and now, are insult to non-beilevers and should be banned as well.

Guest 17.02.2009 21:11

Re: Atheist bus campaign in CH
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Macchiato (Post 398961)
Wait a min.
If Saying "probably god doesn't exist" is an insult to other's beilef, then all religious words written and told in history and now, are insult to non-beilevers and should be banned as well.

No.

Because we're bigger than that.

Aren't we?

Macchiato 17.02.2009 21:12

Re: Atheist bus campaign in CH
 
Quote:

Why don't you make it happen?
It should start from somewhere and slowly going on.
If you give me a boost instead of complaining, I will:msntongue:


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