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Old 16.09.2009, 18:46
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Racism is widespread in Switzerland

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Racism is widespread in Switzerland, despite authorities' continuing efforts to end discrimination, a Council of Europe commission has found.

A report highlights problems of direct racial discrimination in gaining access to employment, housing, goods and services. The victims are mainly Muslims and originate from the Balkans, Turkey and Africa.
The findings published on Tuesday in a report compiled by the European Commission against Racism and Intolerance (ECRI), chart the progress made by Switzerland in implementing recommendations for action in curbing racism made in 2004.
Anti-racism bodies within Switzerland mainly agreed with the findings, but the report was lambasted by the rightwing Swiss People's Party, which was singled out for criticism for promoting racist generalisations.
Full story at Swissinfo

At least it is not silently accepted.
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Old 16.09.2009, 18:54
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Re: Racism is widespread in Switzerland

Been covered in detail before and ended up getting closed.

Are the Swiss Racist?
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Old 16.09.2009, 18:57
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Re: Racism is widespread in Switzerland

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Been covered in detail before and ended up getting closed.

Are the Swiss Racist?
That thread ran from 2005 till 2008, but the Council of Europe just decided today that racism is widespread in Switzerland?
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Old 16.09.2009, 19:37
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Re: Racism is widespread in Switzerland

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That thread ran from 2005 till 2008, but the Council of Europe just decided today that racism is widespread in Switzerland?

Well, some of us know we set the trends, and are way ahead of our time.

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Old 16.09.2009, 19:53
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Re: Racism is widespread in Switzerland

I would say that the first line of the copied statement actually shows religious intolerance, rather than racism. Islam isn't a race.
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Old 16.09.2009, 20:09
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Re: Racism is widespread in Switzerland

Perhaps racism is proportional to the number of stand-up comics.




Don't click unless neighboring ears can take a little strong language.

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Old 16.09.2009, 20:21
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Re: Racism is widespread in Switzerland

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Full story at Swissinfo

At least it is not silently accepted.
One of the problems with this report simply is the linguistic terms. People from the Balkans and around the Mediterranean in general are not victims of racism, but rather of xenophobia (even if the border between these two things is "fluent". Christians like Christian Black Africans or "dark" people from the Caribbean (very well existing in Switzerland) and "dark" Brazilians are however often victims of racism. That the SVP is at least xenophobe however is not exactly new. Overall the situation has immensely improved since the 1960ies. Whenever lots are to be desired .
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Old 16.09.2009, 20:23
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Re: Racism is widespread in Switzerland

Thank you! I get really tired of this constant misuse of the word racism. It is xenophobia or religious intolerance, not racism.


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I would say that the first line of the copied statement actually shows religious intolerance, rather than racism. Islam isn't a race.
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Old 16.09.2009, 20:25
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Re: Racism is widespread in Switzerland

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I would say that the first line of the copied statement actually shows religious intolerance, rather than racism. Islam isn't a race.
Actually on that note - Islam might become one of the state religions in Lucerne, complete with taxes and the like.

Of course, this being Switzerland, they only started on the implementing of the law and this may take years yet.
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Old 16.09.2009, 20:32
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Re: Racism is widespread in Switzerland

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Thank you! I get really tired of this constant misuse of the word racism. It is xenophobia or religious intolerance, not racism.
Same here, it is a pet peeve of mine. I should have also pointed that out...but I was going on the SwissInfo headline
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Old 16.09.2009, 20:46
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Re: Racism is widespread in Switzerland

When my Australian friend baby-sat for my Swiss friend's daughter, the Swiss guy came home to be greeted with "Daddy, daddy, I've learned a new word! Xenophobia".

( "Daddy's" wife is Indonesian, and he moved to Vaud to get away from the racism of Luzern. Vaud just pick on the Portugese... )
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Old 16.09.2009, 21:06
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Re: Racism is widespread in Switzerland

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Vaud just pick on the Portugese... )
I have observed that, though it seems some do it out of a sense of 'duty' or whatever and aren't believers. All the Portuguese I've gotten to know have been gems.
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Old 16.09.2009, 21:19
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Re: Racism is widespread in Switzerland

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Actually on that note - Islam might become one of the state religions in Lucerne, complete with taxes and the like.

Of course, this being Switzerland, they only started on the implementing of the law and this may take years yet.
You for reasons unknown are apparently sure that a majority of the Muslims (a minority in the Canton of Lucerne anyway) are in favour of implementing Koranic laws. I am absolutely sure that a clear majority of Muslims is against such a thing. You don't see the women of the mainstream Muslims as they look just like other women, you don't notice the vast number of male mainstream Muslims because they look and behave like other men.

In case however you mean by "state religions" that Islam is to be in the same status like Protestantism and Catholicism, it is a different thing, and indeed, Islam, Judaism and Greek Orthodoxy may within a not too long time become "official religions". So that Muslims, Jews and Greek Orthodox also will pay "church taxes" but of course in favour of their religion or denomination.



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Same here, it is a pet peeve of mine. I should have also pointed that out...but I was going on the SwissInfo headline
It is not the mistake of the journalists of "SwissInfo" if those folks in the Council of Europe to not succeed to "entblööd" themselves
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Old 17.09.2009, 14:51
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Re: Racism is widespread in Switzerland

Whenever a thread about discrimination against minorities pops up on this forum, whether it concerns making generalizations about the Swiss or Romany, there are always posters claiming "oh, that's only xenophobia," as if the distinction really means anything.

In what way does discrimination based on ethnic background not qualify as racism? Here I default to the UN description of Racial Discrimination:

"the term "racial discrimination" shall mean any distinction, exclusion, restriction or preference based on race, colour, descent, or national or ethnic origin which has the purpose or effect of nullifying or impairing the recognition, enjoyment or exercise, on an equal footing, of human rights and fundamental freedoms in the political, economic, social, cultural or any other field of public life.
"
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Old 17.09.2009, 15:01
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Re: Racism is widespread in Switzerland

Xenophobia is very mild compared to racism. The former is simply a fear of something different, but in no way compares to discrimination/degredation on the basis of one's ethnicity. There's no such thing as race. This isn't 1500, when Europeans categorised people simply on the basis of their skin colour. Racism now involves categorisation based on one's ethnicity and/or skin colour.

It's racism the report refers to, not xenophobia. It seems on this forum and in CH, xenophobia has become a euphemistic label to excuse racism.
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Old 17.09.2009, 15:04
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Re: Racism is widespread in Switzerland

A recent personal example.

At the Zurich airport. A Black individual with a SWISS passport: his passport is checked over with a magnifying glass for 10 minutes. The rest of us with our various European or Swiss passports: waived through. Some of our passports weren't even opened to look at the picture. That is RACISM. He may be used to it, I don't know, but I'd feel like **** being singled out like that in my country obviously because of my ethnic/'racial' appearance.

In same line, the border policeman hassles a Romanian woman for being in the wrong line (EU line) [Romania is part of the EU]. You can see the smirk on his face as he does this. The Romanian woman gives him a lecture that would get you a cavity search in US/Canada. He giggles to the crowd looking for group laugh. This also isn't Xenophobia: it's unnecessary harassment based on her ethnicity, so again a 'mild' form of racism.

Last edited by HashBrown; 17.09.2009 at 15:41. Reason: Added explicit 'Romania is part of EU'.
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Old 17.09.2009, 15:33
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Re: Racism is widespread in Switzerland

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A recent personal example.

At the Zurich airport. A Black individual with a SWISS passport: his passport is checked over with a magnifying glass for 10 minutes. The rest of us with our various European or Swiss passports: waived through. Some of our passports weren't even opened to look at the picture. That is RACISM. He may be used to it, I don't know, but I'd feel like **** being singled out like that in my country obviously because of my ethnic/'racial' appearance.

In same line, the border policeman hassles a Romanian woman for being in the wrong line (EU line). You can see the smirk on his face as he does this. The Romanian woman gives him a lecture that would get you a cavity search in US/Canada. He giggles to the crowd looking for group laugh. This also isn't Xenophobia: it's unnecessary harassment based on her ethnicity, so again a 'mild' form of racism.
I agree. If I am in a hurry, I never choose the passport control booth if there is a person in the queue with dark skin colour as I know I'll have to wait a lot longer to get through. Funny, I do this without even thinking about it

Xenophobia is always used by white people to describe mild forms of racism but, it's racism nonetheless. I have yet to meet a black European/African or Asian who use xenophobia to describe the discrimination they've experienced here.
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Old 17.09.2009, 15:49
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Re: Racism is widespread in Switzerland

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I agree. If I am in a hurry, I never choose the passport control booth if there is a person in the queue with dark skin colour as I know I'll have to wait a lot longer to get through. Funny, I do this without even thinking about it

Xenophobia is always used by white people to describe mild forms of racism but, it's racism nonetheless. I have yet to meet a black European/African or Asian who use xenophobia to describe the discrimination they've experienced here.
Well, that's it. A black or asian person - European or not - stands out because of the distinguishing factors of their race, and are often (unfortunately!) subject to discrimination. That's racist behavior in action.

But racism between, say, a German and a French - they're not a different race, so what is the discrimination based upon? Social notions (the french are [insert stereotype here], the germans are [insert stereotype here]) and may be discriminated against based on their family origin. That's xenophobia.

Xenophobic discrimination is equal to racist discrimination.

Neither are right or correct, and both make me angry.
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Old 17.09.2009, 15:55
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Re: Racism is widespread in Switzerland

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Well, that's it. A black or asian person - European or not - stands out because of the distinguishing factors of their race, and are often (unfortunately!) subject to discrimination. That's racist behavior in action.

But racism between, say, a German and a French - they're not a different race, so what is the discrimination based upon? Social notions (the french are [insert stereotype here], the germans are [insert stereotype here]) and may be discriminated against based on their family origin. That's xenophobia.

Xenophobic discrimination is equal to racist discrimination.

Neither are right or correct, and both make me angry.
Re-read my example of the two different instances, one based on colour, one based on ethnicity. They are both racism.

As I said, there is no such thing as race. So don't know what you mean by the German and French are of the same race. They are from the same continent with a common cultural history. But so is Romania. It's still racism.

But anyways, let's not get pedantic on this. (Sorry to bring in another thread.) I think we still agree in principle. So let's continue to discuss the intent of the original post.
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Old 17.09.2009, 16:04
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Re: Racism is widespread in Switzerland

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But racism between, say, a German and a French - they're not a different race, so what is the discrimination based upon? Social notions (the french are [insert stereotype here], the germans are [insert stereotype here]) and may be discriminated against based on their family origin. That's xenophobia.
That's your opinion, and maybe the definition some other forum-ers are working with, but it's not a definition i've actually encountered before. Even wiki doesn't mention this definition.


The problem I have with it being used on forum is that it often appears to dismiss people's experience of discrimination. It makes the forum a less friendly place for minorities.
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