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  #321  
Old 28.11.2010, 17:51
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

The Swiss have voted to adopt tough new regulations on the deportation of foreigners convicted of serious crimes and welfare fraud.

Final results showed 53 per cent voting in favour of a rightwing initiative. The initiative also won the backing of 18 out of 26 cantons.


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  #322  
Old 28.11.2010, 17:53
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

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I read somewhere that the government has 5 years to enact it. So I am not expecting it to happen overnight... No need for anyone here to panic...yet!
I din`t know the EF is full of Crooks
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  #323  
Old 28.11.2010, 18:01
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

I'm curious to see how the government will put this up, and how will react other countries...
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  #324  
Old 28.11.2010, 18:05
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

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...funny thing is, where there are more foreigners there are less support, and in the mid where there are fewer got a lot of support...
That is not surprising at all. Some would fear the people they know less.
Those who live among foreigners know the latter contribute much to the economy and fabric of Swiss society.
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  #325  
Old 28.11.2010, 18:08
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

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I've also heard from a "politically active" associate that there's going to be a "demonstration" at Helvetiaplatz tonight. How big I've no idea - this is afterall rumour, but my scource is generally correct, so I'd avoid Helvetiaplatz and Langstrasse tonight.
If anyone would like to join, the demonstrations take place at:

Basel: 8pm, Marktplatz

Zuerich: 8pm, Helvetiaplatz

Bern: 6pm, Heiligeistkirche

I don't know the details about Genève & Lausanne, but I'm sure there'll be something going as well
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  #326  
Old 28.11.2010, 18:14
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

I'd love to, but getting arrested participating in an illegal demo will probably get me kicked out of the country. Which is why my 5yr leaving plan just got cut to two.
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If anyone would like to join, the demonstrations take place at:

Basel: 8pm, Marktplatz

Zuerich: 8pm, Helvetiaplatz

Bern: 6pm, Heiligeistkirche

I don't know the details about Genève & Lausanne, but I'm sure there'll be something going as well
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  #327  
Old 28.11.2010, 18:15
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

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...funny thing is, where there are more foreigners there are less support, and in the mid where there are fewer got a lot of support...

Zurich is where the foreigners are, but voted for the SVP initiative. One would think they would vote left.

I'm not sure why Yes/initiative voters voted No on the Gegenvorschlag, as it is an improvement on current laws. I take it as an emphatic statement of disapproval of government. The Gegenvorschlag won more Stichfrage votes than the initiative. Had it passed even by a small margin, it would have had the mandate.

Anyway, I wanted the Gegenvorschlag to win, but in any event, I think this process is a better demonstration of democracy than US democracy.

So the sovereign people of Switzerland have once again spoken. So be it.
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  #328  
Old 28.11.2010, 18:21
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

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I din`t know the EF is full of Crooks
Well if you look at some of the prices in the "For Sale" section of the forum then... Well I'll leave you to draw your own conclusions
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  #329  
Old 28.11.2010, 18:30
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

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What do you think might be the consequences, should the expulsion initiative go through?
I think they should have also voted for initiative "should we also export swiss criminals from Switzerland somewhere in outer space if they commit a crime".

It would also get 53% of the votes I guess.
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  #330  
Old 28.11.2010, 18:31
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

the people of the cities should take more of an initiative and vote as these are the individuals who are surrounded by foreign nationals and have more of an understanding and appreciation of the benefits regarding immigration... unfortunately the majority of voters seem to be from the backwards central areas who vote on impulse...via headlines in the Blick and so on
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  #331  
Old 28.11.2010, 18:49
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

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The Gegenvorschlag won more Stichfrage votes than the initiative. Had it passed even by a small margin, it would have had the mandate.
Which is a bit like saying "If my Grandma had balls she'd be my Grandpa..."
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  #332  
Old 28.11.2010, 18:51
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

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I'm curious to see how the government will put this up, and how will react other countries...
If you asked the same question in the UK I am sure that the initiative would also have been accepted with a resounding "yes". France would probably have agreed also and perhaps Germany. The Dutch would probably also have agreed. What governments spout and what the population feel are, unfortunately, two very different kettle of fish.
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  #333  
Old 28.11.2010, 19:45
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

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What governments spout and what the population feel are, unfortunately, two very different kettle of fish.
Mainly because the governments are full of people who are educated.
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  #334  
Old 28.11.2010, 20:10
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

I am wondering where the going
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  #335  
Old 28.11.2010, 20:16
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

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That is not surprising at all. Some would fear the people they know less.
Those who live among foreigners know the latter contribute much to the economy and fabric of Swiss society.
You absolute right ,but explain to me the contribute the criminal making ?
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  #336  
Old 28.11.2010, 20:25
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

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Zurich is where the foreigners are, but voted for the SVP initiative. One would think they would vote left.
................................
Strange that the vote in Zürich was very close; 50:8% in favour. Strange because Zürich is the home of the extreme part of the SVP & one would have thought they commanded more support in their home base.
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  #337  
Old 28.11.2010, 20:26
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?



Looks like many discussions to look forward too on EF when the first criminal foreigners are actually kicked out.
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  #338  
Old 28.11.2010, 20:45
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

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I read somewhere that the government has 5 years to enact it. So I am not expecting it to happen overnight... No need for anyone here to panic...yet!
http://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/Specials...l?cid=28899524
According to this article, the Swiss are initiating this as we speak...



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you don't see it as unfortunate that it is restricted to foreigners?
It's restricted to foreigners because the people feel that "they let guest in" and they trash up the place. It's like letting someone live in your home and they "trash up the place" they would have to leave. Now if that person was (let's say for example) your 4year old child (not saying you have one) that trashed up the place, you would discipline him in some manner not kick him out. Swiss who commit the same crimes will be reprimanded. But they are Swiss so where are they going to send them?...Makes sense
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  #339  
Old 28.11.2010, 20:46
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

Somaruga explained it very clearly today: many parts of this initiative is legally so nebulous that they have a complex work to do in order to avoid to not only send criminal foreigners out of the country but also the consitution and the international agreements the poeple voted yes to.
In other words: the initiative was put to votation knowing that it it partially against the constitution and agreements voted by the people. Not exactly the most democratic way to go forward, dear SVP/UDC/PPS... (insert smiley of contempt)

The only difference with the present situation is that the expulsions will be automatical. No place for case to case any more. Once again, if one think that law is a PC-programme that kicks in without thinking, that means that one must go back to law-school. Yes, dear SVP/UDC/PPS, that applies to you too.

Not funny at all is the situation of people who will have to be sent to some foreign country by Swiss law but that are not allowed to enter those countries by local law. They can't stay, they can't go. Will they stay in your chalet, then, dear SVP/UDC/PPS members?

Even more interesting for people with a brain (don't even need a hart for that) is the contradiction seen from Brussel/Bruxelles. The same people who voted for Schengen vote now for a law in contradiction with it. Why would they continue to bother talking to Bern if there is no way to secure the respect of the signed agreements... If you want an initiative about Europe, just do so, dear SVP/UDC/PPS.

In short: the SVP/UDC/PPS made a initiative that nobody needed, as the criminals are already sent to their home contries, well aware of the fact that the whole thing was a way of crushing the bilateral agreements and to disrespect on purpose the signature of Switzerland of Schengen. They did not get their will at that time, so they sabotage it... that is exactly the psycho-social developpment stage of a 4 year old. Yes, dear SVP/UDC/PPS, I am talking about you.
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  #340  
Old 28.11.2010, 20:51
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

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Somaruga explained it very clearly today: many parts of this initiative is legally so nebulous that they have a complex work to do in order to avoid to not only send criminal foreigners out of the country but also the consitution and the international agreements the poeple voted yes to.
In other words: the initiative was put to votation knowing that it it partially against the constitution and agreements voted by the people. Not exactly the most democratic way to go forward, dear SVP/UDC/PPS... (insert smiley of contempt)

The only difference with the present situation is that the expulsions will be automatical. No place for case to case any more. Once again, if one think that law is a PC-programme that kicks in without thinking, that means that one must go back to law-school. Yes, dear SVP/UDC/PPS, that applies to you too.

Not funny at all is the situation of people who will have to be sent to some foreign country by Swiss law but that are not allowed to enter those countries by local law. They can't stay, they can't go. Will they stay in your chalet, then, dear SVP/UDC/PPS members?

Even more interesting for people with a brain (don't even need a hart for that) is the contradiction seen from Brussel/Bruxelles. The same people who voted for Schengen vote now for a law in contradiction with it. Why would they continue to bother talking to Bern if there is no way to secure the respect of the signed agreements... Are you trying to trash the Swiss constitution...? that would be worth a real intitiative, dear SVP/UDC/PPS.

In short: the SVP/UDC/PPS made a initiative that nobody needed, as the criminals are already sent to their home contries, well aware of the fact that the whole thing was a way of crushing the bilateral agreements and to disrespect on purpose the signature of Switzerland of Schengen. They did not get their will at that time, so they sabotage it... that is exactly the psycho-social developpment stage of a 4 year old. Yes, dear SVP/UDC/PPS, I am talking about you.
People as well as countries have a right to change their minds.
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