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Old 29.11.2010, 21:26
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

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the council of europe seems to disagree...

http://assembly.coe.int/ASP/NewsMana...sp?ID=6123&L=2

The initiative hasn't developed into a law that can even be legally challenged yet. Also, these are standard statements from Strasbourg. I think they made a similar statement after the minaret initiative. But as of yet, there are no humans rights violations to speak of.
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  #662  
Old 29.11.2010, 21:26
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

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No - I don't need you to tell me why I live here - I know why I live here thank you very much - and actually you don't because you don't know me at all.

I can't accept that if I find one thing unacceptable then I should bugger off? Is that it? That's the foreign policy all over isn't it. Don't agree with everything? Well bugger off then. I'm not allowed to say "sorry I find that unacceptable" I should just pack my bags.

The fact is simply that I already before felt insecure here as a foreigner. Now, today, I feel less secure than a week ago. Sorry if I haven't left yet - but when you have 2 children and a husband and jobs and own a house it's not so simple to up and leave when you feel like it.

But yes, if it were just about feelings then I think I would probably leave it's true.
Well, you've made your choice. So stop making yourself misearable about it...Good Luck To You
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  #663  
Old 29.11.2010, 21:28
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

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No - I don't need you to tell me why I live here - I know why I live here thank you very much - and actually you don't because you don't know me at all.

I can't accept that if I find one thing unacceptable then I should bugger off? Is that it? That's the foreign policy all over isn't it. Don't agree with everything? Well bugger off then. I'm not allowed to say "sorry I find that unacceptable" I should just pack my bags.

The fact is simply that I already before felt insecure here as a foreigner. Now, today, I feel less secure than a week ago. Sorry if I haven't left yet - but when you have 2 children and a husband and jobs and own a house it's not so simple to up and leave when you feel like it.

But yes, if it were just about feelings then I think I would probably leave it's true.
You don,t have to justified what makes you stay or leave. It has nothing to do with this Initiative.

The take it or leave it attitude is always something easy to say when not having bigger and better arguments.

If in the history everyone had accept things the way they were without trying to make them change when they believed it wasn't acceptable, we wouldn't be far avanced. And Switzerland wouldn't be what the country is today.

It is easy to spit on the foreigners and tell them to leave when unhappy. But don't forget that the money coming in this country are from foreigners and foreigns countries.

Give me your cash and shut up attitude doesn't go far for long.
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  #664  
Old 29.11.2010, 21:29
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

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I can't accept that if I find one thing unacceptable then I should bugger off? Is that it? That's the foreign policy all over isn't it. Don't agree with everything? Well bugger off then. I'm not allowed to say "sorry I find that unacceptable" I should just pack my bags.

The fact is simply that I already before felt insecure here as a foreigner. Now, today, I feel less secure than a week ago. Sorry if I haven't left yet - but when you have 2 children and a husband and jobs and own a house it's not so simple to up and leave when you feel like it.

But yes, if it were just about feelings then I think I would probably leave it's true.
Actually, I found through commenting about the current voting that the worries about "what are we forcing our kids into" are rising strong, at least among the circle of parents-with-young-kids-expats that we know. To the EFers with young kids, have you lately been thinking on the possibility of your children suffering racism? anybody has been considering "seriously" about leaving?
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Old 29.11.2010, 21:31
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

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You don,t have to justified what makes you stay or leave. It has nothing to do with this Initiative.

The take it or leave it attitude is always something easy to say when not having bigger and better arguments.

If in the history everyone had accept things the way they were without trying to make them change when they believed it wasn't acceptable, we wouldn't be far avanced. And Switzerland wouldn't be what the country is today.

It is easy to spit on the foreigners and tell them to leave when unhappy. But don't forget that the money coming in this country are from foreigners and foreigns countries.

Give me your cash and shut up attitude doesn't go far for long.
Yes, but theres "tons" more foreigners waiting to come in! Switzerland doesn't have a problem to find people who want to live and work here. Don't forget that. The point is "any of us can leave Switzerland and Switzerland will survive just dandy"...just the way it is.
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  #666  
Old 29.11.2010, 21:32
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

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Actually, I found through commenting about the current voting that the worries about "what are we forcing our kids into" are rising strong, at least among the circle of parents-with-young-kids-expats that we know. To the EFers with young kids, have you lately been thinking on the possibility of your children suffering racism? anybody has been considering "seriously" about leaving?
I love your question and I think this deserve a whole thread for this question itself with a poll.

You should start one and see where it goes!
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  #667  
Old 29.11.2010, 21:32
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

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The take it or leave it attitude is always something easy to say when not having bigger and better arguments, or have Swiss citizenship.
Missed a bit Nil.
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  #668  
Old 29.11.2010, 21:36
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

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Yes, but theres "tons" more foreigners waiting to come in! Switzerland doesn't have a problem to find people who want to live and work here. Don't forget that. The point is "any of us can leave Switzerland and Switzerland will survive just dandy"...just the way it is.
Actually some us do jobs that would likely take money out of Switzerland if we were not working here. Sure maybe just a drop of water, but add a lot of drops and you soon have a flood.

We also contribute to society through our taxes. If you choose to put your head in the sand, because you can, because you don't have the same concerns about residency, then lucky you.

Ironically enough, various Swiss authorities try to encourage foreigners to interact at a political level (even if only locally), but if yours is symptomatic of the attitude one might encounter, why, indeed, bother?
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  #669  
Old 29.11.2010, 21:37
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

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Yes, but theres "tons" more foreigners waiting to come in! Switzerland doesn't have a problem to find people who want to live and work here. Don't forget that. The point is "any of us can leave Switzerland and Switzerland will survive just dandy"...just the way it is.
With the reputation that Switzerland is building slowly on the International scene, your statement will soon be a good old time. When people begin to realised how xenophobe the country is, they will find it more difficult to find skilled people to do some specific job. Other countries will take the opportunities to welcome the foreigners with big warm open arms.

Nothing we didn't see before...
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Old 29.11.2010, 21:37
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

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Actually, I found through commenting about the current voting that the worries about "what are we forcing our kids into" are rising strong, at least among the circle of parents-with-young-kids-expats that we know. To the EFers with young kids, have you lately been thinking on the possibility of your children suffering racism? anybody has been considering "seriously" about leaving?
I wish there was a way I could reassure you that your fears are unwarranted. Do you know any locals you could talk to openly? Perhaps if you could hear their side of the story, you'd realize that the initiative was for most about foreign criminals and the SVP, still mildly strong in the traditional parts of Switzerland, is losing wind in the cities.

Seriously, the Swiss need you and they know that. Why do you think they voted against raising taxes among the rich?
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  #671  
Old 29.11.2010, 21:47
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

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With the reputation that Switzerland is building slowly on the International scene, your statement will soon be a good old time. When people begin to realised how xenophobe the country is, they will find it more difficult to find skilled people to do some specific job. Other countries will take the opportunities to welcome the foreigners with big warm open arms.

Nothing we didn't see before...
You're dreaming...of course you "wish" that would happen. Then you can have your revenge. What has Switzerland done to you but give you a good quality environment to live and this is how you repay them? LOL... because of this initiative. I see you still want the goodies right? Heck...you should walk thru Switzerland like you own it and have a right to stay here. Too many of you let the Swiss scare you. Remember "they bark but don't bite". People are just surprised because they hear about the Red Cross and chocolates, then they think that Switzerland is a push over. Boy, are they surprised after they arrive...it's funny really. I have known so many people where Switzerland has crushed their egos. I can empathize with their sentiments but "it ain't gonna change a thing"...
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  #672  
Old 29.11.2010, 21:58
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

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You're dreaming...of course you "wish" that would happen. Then you can have your revenge. What has Switzerland done to you but give you a good quality environment to live and this is how you repay them? LOL... because of this initiative. I see you still want the goodies right? Heck...you should walk thru Switzerland like you own it and have a right to stay here. Too many of you let the Swiss scare you. Remember "they bark but don't bite". People are just surprised because they hear about the Red Cross and chocolates, then they think that Switzerland is a push over. Boy, are they surprised after they arrive...it's funny really. I have known so many people where Switzerland has crushed their egos. I can empathize with their sentiments but "it ain't gonna change a thing"...
Gosh you are doing a lot of interpretation of what people are telling you...
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  #673  
Old 29.11.2010, 22:05
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

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(bla bla bla removed)
I have known so many people where Switzerland has crushed their egos. I can empathize with their sentiments but "it ain't gonna change a thing"...
This is your "crushed egos" leitmotiv that you keep repeating in this thread and other threads as well. I don't know of any person who had the ego crushed. What i find disturbing is the sick rejoicing you seem to draw from this alleged "crushed" egos. You have this schadenfreude attitude that can only be derived from a failure in your life.
You need to face it, switzerland needs talented foreigners as there is not enough talent in switzerland. Switzerland and its SVP needed foreign countries like Spain, Italy, Germany to get 2 poor swiss out of Lybia after the politicians failed miserably. We are going to make this place a better place be it through naturalisation or protesting and improving things. You better resign yourself to it.
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Old 29.11.2010, 22:06
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

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You're dreaming...of course you "wish" that would happen. Then you can have your revenge. What has Switzerland done to you but give you a good quality environment to live and this is how you repay them? LOL... because of this initiative. I see you still want the goodies right? Heck...you should walk thru Switzerland like you own it and have a right to stay here. Too many of you let the Swiss scare you. Remember "they bark but don't bite". People are just surprised because they hear about the Red Cross and chocolates, then they think that Switzerland is a push over. Boy, are they surprised after they arrive...it's funny really. I have known so many people where Switzerland has crushed their egos. I can empathize with their sentiments but "it ain't gonna change a thing"...
This sounds like you're happy about it!
Nothing more entertaining than patriots living abroad...
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Old 29.11.2010, 22:06
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

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With the reputation that Switzerland is building slowly on the International scene, your statement will soon be a good old time. When people begin to realised how xenophobe the country is, they will find it more difficult to find skilled people to do some specific job. Other countries will take the opportunities to welcome the foreigners with big warm open arms.

Nothing we didn't see before...
It's quite amazing though the number of expats who, when asked how long they have been in Switzerland answer "too long". But when you ask them why they are still here they answer "and where would we go?". The fact is that despite the "difficult Swiss", Switzerland offers a high standard of living, good healthcare, good infrastructure, etc, etc. There is a price to be paid for everything and there are many expats who are willing to pay that price to stay here.
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  #676  
Old 29.11.2010, 22:07
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

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Gosh you are doing a lot of interpretation of what people are telling you...
No of what "you" are writing...it's easy to read between your verbiage. I wish you all would stop pretending like your such "perfect, good samaritans". Like you don't have a xenophobic bone in your body. Like you've never criticized another culture. Like you would give up all you have to go live in the rain forest to help the Amazon people. Please...you're no better than the Swiss who voted for the initiative. They just want a decent country to live in. How about you?
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Old 29.11.2010, 22:08
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

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This sounds like you're happy about it!
Nothing more entertaining than patriots living abroad...
Oh shucks...I'm just a happy critter anyways..
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Old 29.11.2010, 22:10
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

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No of what "you" are writing...it's easy to read between your verbiage. I wish you all would stop pretending like your such "perfect, good samaritans". Like you don't have a xenophobic bone in your body. Like you've never criticized another culture. Like you would give up all you have to go live in the rain forest to help the Amazon people. Please...you're no better than the Swiss who voted for the initiative. They just want a decent country to live in. How about you?
lol, could you prove nil's pont any more?!

ps: you seem to like the word verbiage a lot!
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  #679  
Old 29.11.2010, 22:11
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

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Please...you're no better than the Swiss who voted for the initiative.
I am!

I'm English.

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Old 29.11.2010, 22:12
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Re: What if? Consequences of expulsion initiative being accepted?

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This is your "crushed egos" leitmotiv that you keep repeating in this thread and other threads as well. I don't know of any person who had the ego crushed. What i find disturbing is the sick rejoicing you seem to draw from this alleged "crushed" egos. You have this schadenfreude attitude that can only be derived from a failure in your life.
You need to face it, switzerland needs talented foreigners as there is not enough talent in switzerland. Switzerland and its SVP needed foreign countries like Spain, Italy, Germany to get 2 poor swiss out of Lybia after the politicians failed miserably. We are going to make this place a better place be it through naturalisation or protesting and improving things. You better resign yourself to it.
Oh Dear...I'm scared. Are you one of those "talented foreigners?" I think Switzerland could replace you if they needed to. But of course you want to continue to live here, but hate it too. Two-faced I call it. You shouldn't be a Swiss Citizen because you are not for Switzerland, why should they give it to you? I understand more and more now the Swiss centiment towards "uber priviledged" foreigners.
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