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  #21  
Old 20.07.2011, 14:43
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Re: MFK - Invited for a re-check

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Thanks Tom.

With guides you mean valve-guides or the cylinder-sleeve?
Valve guides.

Pull the plugs and have a look. If they are black and oily, you are burning oil.

Tom
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  #22  
Old 20.07.2011, 14:46
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Re: MFK - Invited for a re-check

all this talk about how easy it is to work on....remember the country we are in. If you dont have a house or an engine bay you can rent...you are not allowed to work on your car....head gaskets are easy but still time consuming so def go to Germany if you have the chance or find a neighborhood garage (i found one here for 90 chf an hour....)

you could also use a thicker oil for a while until you pass inspection , then you are good for 2 years and by then the car will likely be a write off anyways.
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  #23  
Old 20.07.2011, 15:15
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Re: MFK - Invited for a re-check

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If you dont have a house or an engine bay you can rent...you are not allowed to work on your car....
Yes you can, just do what I do and work on it at work!

Tom
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  #24  
Old 20.07.2011, 15:34
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Re: MFK - Invited for a re-check

Thank you very much guys. Very valuable comments, indeed.

During the lunch break, I had the time to do some quick checks.

First, there is no oil (or water, for that matter) in the exhaust. It was only a visual illusion. It is completely dry. I touched it with my thumb from inside and it was only soot.

However, there is a bit of smoke when you rev up the engine. The color is certainly not white, but it is also not bluish. It is more darkish.

Opening the engine oil lid shows no water droplets in the oil, or any other whitish/yellowish/creamy stuff. The oil level is slightly less than where I filled it 4000 KM before. By slightly I mean ca. 300-400 mL.

So what is this?

PS: DIY is also not a bad option for me when it is not too complicated. I am a mechanical engineer and also have a garage in my house. It is only that I have never opened the engine/head before. All other small repairs, I do myself including oil change, etc.

Thanks again for your comments.
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Old 20.07.2011, 15:39
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Re: MFK - Invited for a re-check

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If you have oil in the exhaust gas then that normally that shows up somehow in the exhaust gas (Abgas) test.
Now that's an interesting point. The exhaust test is due at the end of this year. The last test two years ago was okay.

If I do the exhaust gas test and it comes clean, would it be a sufficient proof for the MFK-guys that the engine is in order?
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  #26  
Old 20.07.2011, 15:51
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Re: MFK - Invited for a re-check

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However, there is a bit of smoke when you rev up the engine. The color is certainly not white, but it is also not bluish. It is more darkish.

Opening the engine oil lid shows no water droplets in the oil, or any other whitish/yellowish/creamy stuff. The oil level is slightly less than where I filled it 4000 KM before. By slightly I mean ca. 300-400 mL.

So what is this?
300-400ml is a small amount, but enough to be the smoke you are getting.

I'd do a compression check. If compression is good in all cylinders, then it's probably the valve guides and not the rings.

Tom
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  #27  
Old 20.07.2011, 17:04
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Re: MFK - Invited for a re-check

OK. Before you start pulling the engine to pieces, it does not seem to me that there is a problem with the engine burning oil. I asked a Swiss colleague and he just told me that 'Motor - Dichtheit' means that the engine is leaking something somewhere.

Besides, I doubt that a visual check is good enough to prove that the car is burning too much oil just by looking at the exhaust. I would say that a more scientific approach would be needed such as an Abgas test to measure the level of HCs.

Check again tonight by putting a piece of clean cardboard under the engine bay on the floor. In the morning, see if anything has leaked onto the cardboard overnight.

You may have read on here that the engine bay has to be very clean. People I know have said that their cars failed the mfk just because the engine bay was dirty or had signs of very small leaks from the engine. After a good clean, the car passed the mfk at the next inspection. Have a really good look around. (I believe that the VW golf has the plastic under tray/guard beneath the engine. Remove it and have a good look around)
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  #28  
Old 20.07.2011, 17:15
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Re: MFK - Invited for a re-check

As an after-thought, could it also mean leaking exhaust gases? Is there a leak at the exhaust manifold which can only be heard when the engine is running?
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  #29  
Old 20.07.2011, 17:25
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Re: MFK - Invited for a re-check

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As an after-thought, could it also mean leaking exhaust gases? Is there a leak at the exhaust manifold which can only be heard when the engine is running?
Could be but I doubt that. On the other hand, he clearly said "Das Auto hat Ölverlust" which resulted in the "Motor-Dichtheit" cross on the form. It is clearly this very little smoke that he just could not ignore.
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Old 20.07.2011, 17:27
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Re: MFK - Invited for a re-check

I think using a bit thick oil (as suggested by someone in this thread) and getting a clean Exhaust test could satisfy them.
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  #31  
Old 20.07.2011, 17:29
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Re: MFK - Invited for a re-check

Migros has Castrol 10w60, you could try that.

Tom
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Old 20.07.2011, 18:15
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Re: MFK - Invited for a re-check

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Migros has Castrol 10w60, you could try that.

Tom
I run my Porsche 911 on 15/50 motorcycle oil, much nearer original specs of oil from the 1980's, thicker oil & an engine clean may be all that is needed. A small garage may be helpful in taking the car for its MFK.
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  #33  
Old 20.07.2011, 22:49
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Re: MFK - Invited for a re-check

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Now that's an interesting point. The exhaust test is due at the end of this year. The last test two years ago was okay.

If I do the exhaust gas test and it comes clean, would it be a sufficient proof for the MFK-guys that the engine is in order?
Which section of the form did he write in? If it was an exhaust problem he should have written it in section 14 "Emissions"?
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  #34  
Old 21.07.2011, 21:39
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Re: MFK - Invited for a re-check

Not familiar with the swiss code, but for thicker oil, rather than a 10W60, I would go for a 20W50.
But sometimes these thick oils have high detergent content, which can cause trouble in old engines(esp engines which never have been flushed).

That said, if the car is otherwise running fine, and you want to get another 150,000kms out of the engine, get to the source of the problem.

As many have mentioned, head gasket,as well as rear gasket is not a big deal, and I seriously doubt piston rings are faulty.

That said, if its an emissions kinda problem, and often overlooked culprit is the EGR valve.
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  #35  
Old 22.07.2011, 10:30
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Re: MFK - Invited for a re-check

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Which section of the form did he write in? If it was an exhaust problem he should have written it in section 14 "Emissions"?
He wrote it in the "Motor" (Engine) section actually.

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That said, if the car is otherwise running fine, and you want to get another 150,000kms out of the engine, get to the source of the problem.
As many have mentioned, head gasket,as well as rear gasket is not a big deal, and I seriously doubt piston rings are faulty.
That said, if its an emissions kinda problem, and often overlooked culprit is
the EGR valve.
Yes I also think that this should be possible to keep the car for another 4-5 years because otherwise it is a very clean car with everything in perfect order and almost soundless.

I doubt that EGR is faulty because the idling and acceleration is very smooth, there is no stumbling or stalling.

After some research yesterday, I am more or less confident that bad valve seals are causing this smoke. Just my own understanding and of course your views are welcomed. A question here: Will the spark plugs be oily even when only the valve seals are bad? I tend to think otherwise because the oil will come up only when the rings are gone. I have to verify it today by checking the spark plugs. I really hope that they are only sooty and not oily.

The big thing in changing valve seals that I see is the removing of camshaft and the whole chain-stuff, as mentioned in the workshop manual.
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Old 22.07.2011, 11:52
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Re: MFK - Invited for a re-check

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He wrote it in the "Motor" (Engine) section actually.

............
Well then when you take it back for the second inspection 99% likely you will get a different inspector who will read the form & only check the motor for external oil leaks.

I had a situation once where I failed on a couple of points & one of them was "Motor-Dichtheit". I could not find an oil leak so I ignored the comment.

I took it back & the new (different inspector) was in the pit under the motor for a long time trying to find what I had fixed. He was too proud to ask & then gave me a pass.

BTW, the same vehicle subsequently passed 2 more tests at the usual 2 year interval. I get the impression that sometimes they do not like your face & say Ohl verlust just to wind you up.

One time I had a genuine oil loss & the guy was kind enough to take me into the pit & show me exactly where.
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Old 22.07.2011, 12:14
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Re: MFK - Invited for a re-check

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I get the impression that sometimes they do not like your face & say Ohl verlust just to wind you up.
Really seems to be my case :-) He actually first crossed "Erledigt" and then changed it and marked "NK" (Nackkontrolle).
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  #38  
Old 25.07.2011, 11:19
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Re: MFK - Invited for a re-check

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After some research yesterday, I am more or less confident that bad valve seals are causing this smoke. Just my own understanding and of course your views are welcomed. A question here: Will the spark plugs be oily even when only the valve seals are bad?
Yes, if the intake valve is leaking (but not if only the exhaust valve is).

Tom
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  #39  
Old 04.08.2011, 00:22
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Re: MFK - Invited for a re-check

Hello Again

Good news: The car has passed the test on the second attempt. I used the tip by fatmanfilms to engage a local garage through a friend. Everything including taking the car to MFK by the garage and repairs, etc. was less than 200 CHF. Well that's where friends count :-)

Thank you everyone who contributed on this thread.
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Old 04.08.2011, 12:32
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Re: MFK - Invited for a re-check

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Hello Again

Good news: The car has passed the test on the second attempt. I used the tip by fatmanfilms to engage a local garage through a friend. Everything including taking the car to MFK by the garage and repairs, etc. was less than 200 CHF. Well that's where friends count :-)

Thank you everyone who contributed on this thread.
Pleased it helped, having a local 'oily rag' speaking CHD to the 'expert' can help, especially on anything borderline.
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