Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Help & tips > Transportation/driving  
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 21.11.2011, 11:56
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Basel
Posts: 326
Groaned at 40 Times in 21 Posts
Thanked 30 Times in 21 Posts
Gaggiol0 is considered unworthyGaggiol0 is considered unworthyGaggiol0 is considered unworthyGaggiol0 is considered unworthy
Dealer of winter tires and chains...

I refused to upgrade my tires to winter ones because this winter I will be off my car most of the time.

My dealer says chains won't help much on summer tires, is it true???
Never heard about it !
If I put on chains, no matter what is the tire, they should help !

Plus, he says insurance won't pay the full amount if I have accidents with summer tires on the snow. true?

I know there are no laws in tires so I wonder why this happens, is it written on the insurance contract they behave this way?
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 21.11.2011, 11:59
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 8,718
Groaned at 317 Times in 244 Posts
Thanked 20,046 Times in 6,992 Posts
k_and_e has a reputation beyond reputek_and_e has a reputation beyond reputek_and_e has a reputation beyond reputek_and_e has a reputation beyond reputek_and_e has a reputation beyond reputek_and_e has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Dealer of winter tires and chains...

Everything your dealer has told you is true.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank k_and_e for this useful post:
  #3  
Old 21.11.2011, 12:02
Mud's Avatar
Mud Mud is offline
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Romandie
Posts: 2,551
Groaned at 26 Times in 23 Posts
Thanked 5,004 Times in 1,827 Posts
Mud has a reputation beyond reputeMud has a reputation beyond reputeMud has a reputation beyond reputeMud has a reputation beyond reputeMud has a reputation beyond reputeMud has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Dealer of winter tires and chains...

If you put on winter tires you will have increased traction in all cold conditions. If you put on chains you will have increased traction in icy conditions, but will be stuck driving <50 and look like a knob (are you thinking of leaving them on always?!).

From everything I've heard you are at risk of some nasty insurance surprises if you have an accident on summer tires in winter. Not sure of the details.

But, unless you have some crazy car, you should be able to put some nice high quality winter tires on for ~700 or less. Ought to get two winters out of them no probs. They aren't a cure-all, but for me it's worth a few hundred bucks for the peace of mind and increased safety.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 21.11.2011, 12:03
vwild1
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Dealer of winter tires and chains...

Quote:
View Post
My dealer says chains won't help much on summer tires, is it true???
Never heard about it !
If I put on chains, no matter what is the tire, they should help !
Of course it will help but the question is, how often do you see chains on cars in the lower elevation areas of Switzerland?

I've lived here now 24 years and I have yet to drive with chains on my car but in California I had chains on my car (with summer tires) nearly every weekend.

Winter tires on the other hand help more during the winter because they perform better than summer tires do on cold/wet/icy pavement.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 21.11.2011, 12:10
fatmanfilms's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Verbier
Posts: 21,376
Groaned at 461 Times in 352 Posts
Thanked 23,091 Times in 11,824 Posts
fatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Dealer of winter tires and chains...

Quote:
View Post
I If you put on chains you will have increased traction in icy conditions, but will be stuck driving <50 and look like a knob (are you thinking of leaving them on always?!).
Totally incorrect, chains only help with snon on the road. Tires grip the road way better than a small area of metal-
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank fatmanfilms for this useful post:
  #6  
Old 21.11.2011, 12:17
Mud's Avatar
Mud Mud is offline
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Romandie
Posts: 2,551
Groaned at 26 Times in 23 Posts
Thanked 5,004 Times in 1,827 Posts
Mud has a reputation beyond reputeMud has a reputation beyond reputeMud has a reputation beyond reputeMud has a reputation beyond reputeMud has a reputation beyond reputeMud has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Dealer of winter tires and chains...

Quote:
View Post
Totally incorrect, chains only help with snon on the road. Tires grip the road way better than a small area of metal-
For realz? Did not know that. But I've only used mine once (to get out of snow that had compacted into ice ). Still, it sounds like the OP might have the kooky notion that he can slap chains on and drive around all winter .
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 21.11.2011, 18:11
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Basel
Posts: 326
Groaned at 40 Times in 21 Posts
Thanked 30 Times in 21 Posts
Gaggiol0 is considered unworthyGaggiol0 is considered unworthyGaggiol0 is considered unworthyGaggiol0 is considered unworthy
Re: Dealer of winter tires and chains...

i will check my insurance contract, anyway if I put chains then they work, for me it's already fine, i should not spend such money also because my car during winter is pretty much always in my box
Reply With Quote
This user groans at Gaggiol0 for this post:
  #8  
Old 21.11.2011, 18:29
Mud's Avatar
Mud Mud is offline
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Romandie
Posts: 2,551
Groaned at 26 Times in 23 Posts
Thanked 5,004 Times in 1,827 Posts
Mud has a reputation beyond reputeMud has a reputation beyond reputeMud has a reputation beyond reputeMud has a reputation beyond reputeMud has a reputation beyond reputeMud has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Dealer of winter tires and chains...

Quote:
View Post
i will check my insurance contract, anyway if I put chains then they work, for me it's already fine, i should not spend such money also because my car during winter is pretty much always in my box
And what if you have an accident on one of those rare days out? Summer tires perform less well even in dry conditions in the cold (there's a long thread on this subject somewhere here). So you get 3 seasons out of your winter tires- they're worth the peace of mind, really.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 21.11.2011, 18:39
Sbrinz's Avatar
RIP
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Murten - Morat
Posts: 11,866
Groaned at 563 Times in 354 Posts
Thanked 11,548 Times in 5,941 Posts
Sbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Dealer of winter tires and chains...

Quote:
View Post
i will check my insurance contract, anyway if I put chains then they work, for me it's already fine, i should not spend such money also because my car during winter is pretty much always in my box
Then hand in the car plates and save some tax and insurance. There is a very adequate public transport system, which can be supplemented with taxis where necessary.

You really cannot consider driving on summer tyres. Only if the road is dry would this be acceptable. Then if it snows are you going to leave the car at your destination?

When you fit winter tyres you are not using the summer tyres, so they will last longer.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 21.11.2011, 18:40
TiMow's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Fribourg
Posts: 9,295
Groaned at 237 Times in 154 Posts
Thanked 12,188 Times in 5,300 Posts
TiMow has a reputation beyond reputeTiMow has a reputation beyond reputeTiMow has a reputation beyond reputeTiMow has a reputation beyond reputeTiMow has a reputation beyond reputeTiMow has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Dealer of winter tires and chains...

Quote:

Winter tyre and snow chain requirements
Quote:



Country ------------- Winter tyres --------------- Snow chains
Switzerland ----------- R(2) ------------------------- C

Key:
P = Permitted
R = Recommended
M = Mandatory
C = Compulsory. Carry chains and use them as dictated by local signs or road conditions. Reduced speed limits may apply.

Notes

(1) - All vehicles driving on snow covered roads must have winter tyres (or all-season tyres marked M&S/mud and snow) during the winter season (from 1 November to 15 April) and if roads have a covering of snow, slush or ice outside these dates. Tyres must have a minimum tread depth of 4mm.
Theoretically snow chains on summer tyres can be used as an alternative to winter tyres where the entire road is heavily covered with snow and no damage to the road is caused by the snow chains. In practice though, because road conditions and the weather cannot be predicted, use of winter tyres is effectively compulsory.
(2) - Snow tyres are not compulsory but vehicles not equipped to travel through snow and which impede traffic are liable to a fine.
From this link:
http://www.theaa.com/motoring_advice...ter-tyres.html

Quote:

Chaînes à neige obligatoires
: means that snow chains must be put on the tyres. In winter, insurance companies will not accept responsibility for vehicles that do not have winter tyres
From here:
http://geneva.angloinfo.com/countrie...nd/driving.asp

"A fool and his money are easily parted".
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank TiMow for this useful post:
  #11  
Old 21.11.2011, 18:51
tom tulpe's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Horgen
Posts: 1,182
Groaned at 21 Times in 19 Posts
Thanked 1,409 Times in 646 Posts
tom tulpe has a reputation beyond reputetom tulpe has a reputation beyond reputetom tulpe has a reputation beyond reputetom tulpe has a reputation beyond reputetom tulpe has a reputation beyond repute
Are you the idiot I'll be stuck behind this coming winter?

Quote:
View Post
i will check my insurance contract, anyway if I put chains then they work, for me it's already fine, i should not spend such money also because my car during winter is pretty much always in my box
OK, so you'll be on summer tyres, you will have chains (which you can only use on snow covered roads or solid ice because otherwise they make a hash of the tarmac and have a max. speed of 50). I guess you will be the idiot I'll be stuck behind this coming winter on some hill that's covered in slush after the first snowfall. Get winter tyres or get off the road.

But you saved some bob so that's all right then.

Last edited by tom tulpe; 21.11.2011 at 18:52. Reason: Hit "reply" before the end of the rant...
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank tom tulpe for this useful post:
  #12  
Old 21.11.2011, 18:56
fatmanfilms's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Verbier
Posts: 21,376
Groaned at 461 Times in 352 Posts
Thanked 23,091 Times in 11,824 Posts
fatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Dealer of winter tires and chains...

If you don't take your car out if there is snow on the ground, or if it's icy then it's OK, rather like riding a motorbike here in winter. If you want to be able to use the car regardless then you should get winter or all season tires.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 21.11.2011, 19:53
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Zug
Posts: 114
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 26 Times in 22 Posts
dibbydoo has no particular reputation at present
Re: Dealer of winter tires and chains...

Why do you only expect to get 2 or 3 seasons out of winter tyres? Surely that should last just as long as a summer tyre, unless you are doing much more mileage in the winter?
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 21.11.2011, 20:13
fatmanfilms's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Verbier
Posts: 21,376
Groaned at 461 Times in 352 Posts
Thanked 23,091 Times in 11,824 Posts
fatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Dealer of winter tires and chains...

Quote:
View Post
Why do you only expect to get 2 or 3 seasons out of winter tyres? Surely that should last just as long as a summer tyre, unless you are doing much more mileage in the winter?
The go hard after 3 years from date of manufacture, don't keep them forever. They are softer they won't do quite so many KM. As you should always have 4mm of tread rather than 2mm (1.6 legal) on summer tires.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank fatmanfilms for this useful post:
  #15  
Old 22.11.2011, 13:45
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Zurich
Posts: 35
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 48 Times in 13 Posts
Ep32 has no particular reputation at present
Re: Dealer of winter tires and chains...

Further benefit of having both winter and summer tyres: If your winter tyres still have enough of a tread but are not usable in winter conditions (say after 3 winters), you can use them for the following period till the next winter starts and save yourself one season of summer tyre usage. This is what I did this year. Even though winter tyres heat up much quicker, they will not overheat.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 23.11.2011, 00:28
ccmiller's Avatar
Newbie 1st class
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Zurich
Posts: 18
Groaned at 3 Times in 2 Posts
Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts
ccmiller has earned some respectccmiller has earned some respect
Re: Dealer of winter tires and chains...

So is there any truth to the above point about being (more) liable in an accident if you're caught driving in winter without winter tires? Is there a clear period for when this expectation starts (Dec?) and ends (April?)
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 23.11.2011, 07:48
NotAllThere's Avatar
Modulo 2
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Baselland
Posts: 15,046
Groaned at 307 Times in 263 Posts
Thanked 23,226 Times in 9,433 Posts
NotAllThere has a reputation beyond reputeNotAllThere has a reputation beyond reputeNotAllThere has a reputation beyond reputeNotAllThere has a reputation beyond reputeNotAllThere has a reputation beyond reputeNotAllThere has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Dealer of winter tires and chains...

Quote:
View Post
...My dealer says chains won't help much on summer tires, is it true???
If you're in conditions requiring chains, then they're probably as effective on winter, as much as summer tyres. Of course, limited to 50kph.
Quote:
Plus, he says insurance won't pay the full amount if I have accidents with summer tires on the snow. true?
This is a myth. While I use winter and summer tyres, I know people who don't. And their insurance companies have said, when asked, that so long as the tyres are in good condition, they don't care if you have all-season, summer or winter tyres. If you're only driving on cleared roads, then I don't see a problem. Otherwise, I'd think you're foolish not having the proper equipment for the conditions.

If you are unsure, ask your insurance company for a definitive answer.
__________________
Down with racism. Long live miscegenation!
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 23.11.2011, 08:06
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Zurich
Posts: 35
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 48 Times in 13 Posts
Ep32 has no particular reputation at present
Re: Dealer of winter tires and chains...

I think the police would give you hell if you caused an accident in winter & had no winter tyres. Winte rtyres have a different tread pattern and heat up quicker. Theoretically, summer tyres are ok for as long as there is no snow or slush lying around. Summer tyres will not do much good in the snow, it is like driving a rear wheel drive. I have never asked an insurer because I was always told that if you use your summer flip flops instead of your winter booties in winter, you're saving the insurer a lot of paperwork as he will laugh at any claim.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 23.11.2011, 08:48
vwild1
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Dealer of winter tires and chains...

A comparison of summer/all-season/winter tires on ice.




The illustrated differences between all-season and winter tires.

Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank for this useful post:
  #20  
Old 23.11.2011, 09:39
Mark75's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: by the lake (either one)
Posts: 2,510
Groaned at 45 Times in 39 Posts
Thanked 3,136 Times in 1,363 Posts
Mark75 has a reputation beyond reputeMark75 has a reputation beyond reputeMark75 has a reputation beyond reputeMark75 has a reputation beyond reputeMark75 has a reputation beyond reputeMark75 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Dealer of winter tires and chains...

Quote:
View Post
So is there any truth to the above point about being (more) liable in an accident if you're caught driving in winter without winter tires? Is there a clear period for when this expectation starts (Dec?) and ends (April?)
It does not depend on the time of the year but on the weather and road conditions at the time and location of the accident. If you have an accident on a dry road on a sunny day with temps above zero nobody should bat an eye, however if the accident happens on a road covered with snow or ice you'll be out of luck.

Last edited by Mark75; 23.11.2011 at 09:55.
Reply With Quote
Reply




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Sales tax when buying car ... and winter tires Joy2 Transportation/driving 20 21.01.2011 14:14


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 08:48.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0