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Old 31.08.2016, 12:35
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Re: Why So Few Hybrid Cars?

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Even if the electrical system is entirely coal fed, the electric car is better than an IC engine from an efficiency standpoint, but electrical heating wastes 6.6%
But it sounds rubbish

Give me a cross-plane V8 any day - add side pipes for extra fun.
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  #162  
Old 31.08.2016, 12:40
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Re: Why So Few Hybrid Cars?

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But it sounds rubbish

Give me a cross-plane V8 any day - add side pipes for extra fun.
A Foden or Allchin traction engine is a thing of beauty with an awe inspiring sound as well, if a bit less fun at an autocross.
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  #163  
Old 31.08.2016, 14:06
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Why So Few Hybrid Cars?

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Here is a link to some information:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electr...mission#Losses



If the electricity is used for nothing other than generating heat, then something near to 6.6% is lost before you get any heat at the house whatsoever.



This 6.6% is on top of the extraction and generation energy.



Oil, coal, gas and wood also have transport costs, but this information is more difficult to come by, and probably varies significantly. Chopping a tree down in the forest next door and even transporting it with a tractor is almost certainly below 6.6%.



Have a look at the efficiency of IC engines:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Engine...ustion_engines



A fuel burning car only converts a small part of the fuel energy into kinetic energy, a steam turbine generating electricity is about 10% more efficient than a really efficient IC engine.



Even if the electrical system is entirely coal fed, the electric car is better than an IC engine from an efficiency standpoint, but electrical heating wastes 6.6%
So a steam turbine is 10% better, but transmission losses are 6.6%, so we have 3.3%.
Tesla overall car efficiency (charger, battery, inverter, motor) is about 70%. So...
Well, according to these calculations, due to other factors, the overall efficiency of electric car due to better efficiency of power plants is roughly double the internal combustion engine. I'd never thought so because I thought the engines are more efficient and there is more transmission loss in the electric grid.
https://matter2energy.wordpress.com/...ar-efficiency/

Last edited by yacek; 31.08.2016 at 14:17.
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  #164  
Old 31.08.2016, 14:52
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Re: Why So Few Hybrid Cars?

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So a steam turbine is 10% better, but transmission losses are 6.6%, so we have 3.3%.
Tesla overall car efficiency (charger, battery, inverter, motor) is about 70%. So...
Well, according to these calculations, due to other factors, the overall efficiency of electric car due to better efficiency of power plants is roughly double the internal combustion engine. I'd never thought so because I thought the engines are more efficient and there is more transmission loss in the electric grid.
https://matter2energy.wordpress.com/...ar-efficiency/
Thanks for that link. There are a few apple to apple comparisons, One of the first ones I remember was more than 10 years ago, published in Scientific American. Here is a more recent one:

http://www.scientificamerican.com/ar...ndly-vehicles/

In a nutshell, even if charging from a coal fired source the carbon footprint of an EV is still better than an economy car, and the figures only get better.

Looking at the numbers is always interesting. Almost everyone thinks that gasoline and fuel is expensive. Compare the current pump price/l to Beer. With the exception of only the cheapest beer (coop Prix guarantee) fossil fuels are cheaper. Most people do a double take when I point this out.
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  #165  
Old 31.08.2016, 15:00
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Re: Why So Few Hybrid Cars?

damn, and I just bought a beer powered car
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  #166  
Old 31.08.2016, 15:02
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Re: Why So Few Hybrid Cars?

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Looking at the numbers is always interesting. Almost everyone thinks that gasoline and fuel is expensive. Compare the current pump price/l to Beer. With the exception of only the cheapest beer (coop Prix guarantee) fossil fuels are cheaper. Most people do a double take when I point this out.
Caution!
I had the painful discovery that drinking beer and cars is actually very costly
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  #167  
Old 31.08.2016, 15:03
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Re: Why So Few Hybrid Cars?

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damn, and I just bought a beer powered car
Can you imagine? Many would siphon your car on the parking!
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  #168  
Old 31.08.2016, 15:05
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Re: Why So Few Hybrid Cars?

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Can you imagine? Many would siphon your car on the parking!

already thought about that, gonna only use feldschlösschen, no one would siphon off that crap
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  #169  
Old 31.08.2016, 15:26
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Re: Why So Few Hybrid Cars?

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Can you imagine? Many would siphon your car on the parking!
It would certainly make changing a fuel gauge sender a more enjoyable experience.

Why is it that the last thing that owners do when the fuel gauge seems to be on the blink is fill the damned tank?
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