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  #21  
Old 21.04.2012, 14:35
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Re: Driving License Fiasco

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Actually it doesn't. The word "residency" probably doesn't appear anywhere in the Swiss Code of Obligations because they tend to have their own laws written in their own languages.
Actually it does - but not in the Code of Obligations but in the AuG and attached ordinances that govern the right to accessing to the C permit.

This is a bit more involved than what you might have heard "down at the pub".

The key phrase you'll be looking for is " sich in der Schweiz aufgehalten haben".

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  #22  
Old 21.04.2012, 14:53
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Re: Driving License Fiasco

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So we can discuss it on here until the cows come home, but at the end of the day (rightly or wrongly) you now need to take a test if you want a driving licence...

Does seem a bit harsh as you haven't been driving so haven't needed to change it previously, and I know people who have changed their licence after 12 months with no problem other than a tut and a 'you've been naughty' stare from the person at the licence office...
I kind of expected to have to do the test, and in a way I'm looking forward to it as it gives me another chance to test my driving skills and judgment in addition to the high-speed runs through Germany. I don't need a car for work and have never thought of them as "must have essentials". To me the car is a leisure accessory; just metal that one does not need to get emotionally attached to, let alone reliant upon. If I have to take it, I will drive the same way as on an advanced test, complete with commentary, in order perhaps to demonstrate experience. It never hurts to put one's skills to the test, and certainly not in front of a professional tester.

I do have certain objections though. The costs incurred. The arbitrary nature of the driving test due to the pass/fail decision being based on statistics and not ability. The failure of driving test standards to contribute to road safety is another objection, as is the routine re-issuance of suspended licenses to drink driver's and other serious offenders who rarely get retested unlike those dangerous drivers who fail to file their papers on time.

The test should be fun.

I have driven over half a million kilometers through twenty countries in every possible climatic condition in vehicles weighing up to 13t at speeds up to 260km/h (my current personal land speed record. I've frequently driven more than a 1000km per day and think nothing of a 1,600km round-trip weekend commute (I drive a GT to make it easier on the old back nowadays ;-). I'll probably pay a Swiss instructor to take me through a mock test first as well, and I'll be applying to do an advanced Swiss driving course as soon as I've passed the damn test. But if I don't have to do it, I won't.
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  #23  
Old 21.04.2012, 14:54
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Re: Driving License Fiasco

First, the law is simple and clear:

Art 42 Abs. 3bis Verkehrszulassungsverordnung
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3bis Einen schweizerischen Führerausweis benötigen:
a.
Fahrzeugführer aus dem Ausland, die seit zwölf Monaten in der Schweiz wohnen und sich in dieser Zeit nicht länger als drei Monate ununterbrochen im Ausland aufgehalten haben;

A Swiss driving license needs:

Drivers from other countries, which live for at least twelve months in Switzerland and have not been aboard for longer than 3 month at a single time.
Second, there is no "reduced speed" with a learners permit. As long as you stay within legal speed limit, as everyone else on the road, it is o.k.

Third, if you a barred to drive in your country of residence you are barred to drive in Germany.
§28 Abs 4 and §29 Abs. 3 Fahrerlaubnis-Verordnung
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  #24  
Old 21.04.2012, 14:58
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Re: Driving License Fiasco

my understanding was that if you exchanged your licence within 12 months of arriving here, you could do it without having to do a test (at least with a UK licence).

although i never owned a car and have barely driven since getting my licence, i converted it within the 12 months to avoid having to re-test.

if you want a swiss licence it probably makes sense to convert it within you first 12 months even if you don't think you'll be driving for the next 5 years here.

that said, i've known of people who managed to convert many years after the 12 months, but that was after charming the local strassenvekehrsamt (not quoting rules and regulations at them).
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  #25  
Old 21.04.2012, 15:15
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Re: Driving License Fiasco

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I have driven over half a million kilometers through twenty countries in every possible climatic condition in vehicles weighing up to 13t at speeds up to 260km/h (my current personal land speed record. I've frequently driven more than a 1000km per day and think nothing of a 1,600km round-trip weekend commute (I drive a GT to make it easier on the old back nowadays ;-). I'll probably pay a Swiss instructor to take me through a mock test first as well, and I'll be applying to do an advanced Swiss driving course as soon as I've passed the damn test. But if I don't have to do it, I won't.

So in addition to being a whinger you also think you are the best driver on this planet by quoting how good you think you are !!
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  #26  
Old 21.04.2012, 15:16
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Re: Driving License Fiasco

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First, the law is simple and clear:

Second, there is no "reduced speed" with a learners permit. As long as you stay within legal speed limit, as everyone else on the road, it is o.k.
Are learner's allowed on the autobahn here? I see a of L-plates on the Swiss autobahns, but maybe that's just the instructors driving between lessons.
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  #27  
Old 21.04.2012, 15:19
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Re: Driving License Fiasco

The same rule applies to Belgium.
I hadn't realized I needed to change my then current UK driving licence after 12 months in the country.
I didn't have to take a new driving test, but I was pretty heavily fined after being stopped in a random police check some 18 months after arriving in Brussels.
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  #28  
Old 21.04.2012, 15:27
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Re: Driving License Fiasco

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So in addition to being a whinger you also think you are the best driver on this planet by quoting how good you think you are !!
You shouldn't mistake confidence for arrogance. Nowhere did I ever suggest that that makes me anything more than an experienced driver. "Good" and "world's best" are words you chose, and they are straw men.

Prior to your selective quote-mining I wrote about my willingness to put my skills to the test and the intention to seek professional advice first, thus setting the context as one of conscious self-doubt - the exact opposite. I will leave it, if I have to, to the examiner to judge my ability (in spite of my reservations), and certainly not you - you can't even construct an insult without hacking all the meaning out of it first.
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  #29  
Old 21.04.2012, 15:30
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Re: Driving License Fiasco

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Are learner's allowed on the autobahn here? I see a of L-plates on the Swiss autobahns, but maybe that's just the instructors driving between lessons.
Yes, they are allowed when they are "fit for the test". Furthermore, driving on the Autobahn can be part of the test (Where you have to show your tailgating skills, and acceleration over three lanes from the entry lane ).

Art. 27 Abs. 4 VRV
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Fahrschüler dürfen verkehrsreiche Strassen erst befahren, wenn sie genügend ausgebildet sind, Autobahnen und Autostrassen erst, wenn sie prüfungsreif sind.
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  #30  
Old 21.04.2012, 15:39
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Re: Driving License Fiasco

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that said, i've known of people who managed to convert many years after the 12 months, but that was after charming the local strassenvekehrsamt (not quoting rules and regulations at them).
I play the same game ;-)

I'll leave the guys on here to quote the rules and regulations, and from those that appear relevant I shall construct a theme for my "appeal".

As I understand it the people working in the strassenverkehrsamt already know all the rules and regulations as well as what they all mean in practice as well as in theory. I therefore wish to present them with a documented narrative that they will understand as fully consistent with the law (or at worst an understandable and forgivable error on the part of a typical well-meaning ignorant foreigner) and consequently waive any test malarky.

As for being charming, my arbeitsloskasse was in my bank account within 24hours of me speaking to the nice lady and only four weeks after I had resigned from my job (she agreed that I was right to resign). So I don't think I'll be needing any help in that area. Just background info that I can write into the script, so to speak ;-)
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  #31  
Old 21.04.2012, 15:58
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Re: Driving License Fiasco

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My experience is that principles always come with a price tag...your's will probably be having to take public transport.
My experience is that people who put a price tag on their principles usually don't have any.

As for the public transport I use it all the time. It's the best in the world and I have a GA. This isn't England. Public transport here is the preferred option.

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What I don't understand is why you come on here and ask a question and then have a go at anyone that doesn't tell you what you want to hear....
I came and asked a question because I was seeking information. Those who have given me info have been thanked. Those who have misquoted me for no reason other than to try to insult, whatever their motivation might be, may be replied to in kind.

Last edited by alt-f4; 21.04.2012 at 16:37.
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  #32  
Old 21.04.2012, 16:10
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Re: Driving License Fiasco

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Yes, they are allowed when they are "fit for the test". Furthermore, driving on the Autobahn can be part of the test (Where you have to show your tailgating skills, and acceleration over three lanes from the entry lane ).

Art. 27 Abs. 4 VRV
Thanks.

I think the only mention of mororways when I took my test was when they asked me what colour the signs were ;-)
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  #33  
Old 21.04.2012, 16:38
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Re: Driving License Fiasco

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My license has another twenty years to go before it expires.
.
No true as you do not live at the address written on the license. By law you have to inform DVLA within 14? days of a change of address. When you move house you get a current photo license which expires every 10 years.

As your license is not legal in the UK, it's not legal anywhere else.
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  #34  
Old 21.04.2012, 16:58
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Re: Driving License Fiasco

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No true as you do not live at the address written on the license. By law you have to inform DVLA within 14? days of a change of address. When you move house you get a current photo license which expires every 10 years.

As your license is not legal in the UK, it's not legal anywhere else.
[post deleted]

Last edited by alt-f4; 21.04.2012 at 17:23. Reason: Quoted post was deceptive and does not warrent a reply.
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  #35  
Old 21.04.2012, 17:07
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Re: Driving License Fiasco

Some times I wonder about some of the Queens subjects
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Old 21.04.2012, 17:14
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Re: Driving License Fiasco

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I am not one of those people who simply conform with anything somebody in a uniform or with a rubber-stamp tells me.
While I like that kind of attitude up to some point...

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If I have to take it, I will drive the same way as on an advanced test, complete with commentary, in order perhaps to demonstrate experience. It never hurts to put one's skills to the test, and certainly not in front of a professional tester.
...I suggest you adjust it a little when taking the test. Might not go down so well with the DMV expert.
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Old 21.04.2012, 17:14
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Re: Driving License Fiasco

The important thing to do is to change it within 12 months of arriving in Switzerland, you will need to go for an eye test first, the opticians know what is needed then they will send your old lience back to DVLA in Swansea (If, of course, you are a UK citizen) and then they will give you a new one. Unless you want to do the medical as well you lose the agricultural vehicle allowances, but if you have a motorbike one they will transfer

After 12 months it is a test, in the local cantonal language I am afraid L permit or not...
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  #38  
Old 21.04.2012, 17:14
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Re: Driving License Fiasco

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No true as you do not live at the address written on the license. By law you have to inform DVLA within 14? days of a change of address. When you move house you get a current photo license which expires every 10 years.

As your license is not legal in the UK, it's not legal anywhere else.
From the DVLA website

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Motoring...ng/DG_10023103

Moving to another country

If you move to another country, you should check with the driving licence authorities there for information about driving and exchange of licences. You don't need to notify DVLA of a change of address when moving to live abroad.
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  #39  
Old 21.04.2012, 17:20
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Re: Driving License Fiasco

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While I like that kind of attitude up to some point...


...I suggest you adjust it a little when taking the test. Might not go down so well with the DMV expert.
Yeah, that's why I want to go through it with an instructor first. Get one of them to take me through a mock test first and pick up any particular points that the Swiss will be looking out for. Such as speeding, tail-gating and driving on the left all of which are usually frowned upon but appear to be mandatory if you drive with AG plates.
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Old 21.04.2012, 17:42
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Re: Driving License Fiasco

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I have had my license taken away and I have to retake my test on the grounds that I didn't have a valid license during the period in which I didn't have a car and never drove.

(snipped)

Are L-permit holders really required to change their driving license to a Swiss one, even if they don't drive?
The exact same thing happened to me, with the twist that the Zurich Strassenverkehrsamt also gave me false information. When we first moved, I was told by them that since I didn't have a car, I didn't need to switch my license. When I moved to Lausanne 18 months later we got a car, I went to change my US license and I found out that I had one year to change it and now would have to start at the beginning.

Vaud, for those of you who don't know, has the road test lowest pass rate of all the cantons. I also do not enjoy driving and did not drive much even when I had a license. After shelling out massive cash to pay for driving lessons and take the first aid test and all that other stuff and taken the written test (and past), I have failed the Swiss road test three times.

When I have a couple grand to burn I will try again in Zurich. I can't drive anywhere else now because the state of Mississippi has changed its rules in the meantime for how people can renew their licenses and that is my legal US address. I will never be a big driver but I enjoyed having a license in situations where, for example, the people with me were drunk.

Sucks that it happened to you but it happened to me too. Whenever anyone comes to Switzerland now I tell them to transfer their license first thing.

Let us be an example, newcomers to Switzerland...
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