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  #21  
Old 11.12.2012, 23:49
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Re: Fine for driving 52 km/hr

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Hi
I got a 40 SFR fine for driving 52 km/hr instead of the permitted limit 50 km/hr. I strongly doubt their devices as I was closely tracking the velocity. Is there an appeal process for that?

As first step, I would request that they proof that they have a picture of my car, and a proof that their velocity check devices are regularly checked and maintained.

I don;t care about the 40 SFR (if I write an appeal, I would anyway waste effectively more than 40 SFR). It is really the essence now of their silly fines which matters and I would like to fight back.

Thanks for your time
It's amazing how many speeding tickets are not fair. One day maybe some will post on EF that they got a tickets and they were in the wrong.

Just pay it, move on and put it down to experience. Yes, there are a lot of 50 zones where maybe there wouldn't be in other countries. But that's the way it is, get used to it.
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  #22  
Old 12.12.2012, 00:01
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Re: Fine for driving 52 km/hr

Good point of this thread is that some quite precise info came out of it.

What however I don't understand very well is that quite often I get the impression that asking institutional offices would be considered a shame, asking for proof rather illicit and making an appeal a terrible crime.

In such case I personally would have made a phone call to the issuing office and cleared things up (my doubts, how much speed, given proofs, maybe rights and duties). Depending on the outcome, one could always still consider a possible appeal.

I mean this still is a democracy ...
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  #23  
Old 12.12.2012, 00:08
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Re: Fine for driving 52 km/hr

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In such case I personally would have made a phone call to the issuing office and cleared things up (my doubts, how much speed, given proofs, maybe rights and duties). Depending on the outcome, one could always still consider a possible appeal.
Read my lips... W A S T E . O F . T I M E .... and the cost of the call
Unless you were in jail or the car was stolen at that exact moment.
JC
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  #24  
Old 12.12.2012, 00:13
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Re: Fine for driving 52 km/hr

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Read my lips... W A S T E . O F . T I M E .... and the cost of the call
JC
You mean they wouldn't be able to tell me at what speed I was going and if it were a laser or a picture taken as a proof?


Btw yes, also what you got from what I could have meant actually might do the trick in some issues. This is Switzerland after all, not Germany or Italy. Much more bargaining power and space to interpretation of a given situation
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Old 12.12.2012, 00:14
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Re: Fine for driving 52 km/hr

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It's amazing how many speeding tickets are not fair. One day maybe some will post on EF that they got a tickets and they were in the wrong.
I`ll take up the challenge. Coming back out of Luzern tonight where I don`t go so often I was just driving along following traffic and then two quick flashes in front, I took my foot off the accelerator quickly but there was a 3rd flash.

Assume that`s 3 of us that caught. I was probably 88 (speedo) in an 80km. Given the tolerances it could be registered as 1 or 2 km over. I will shut up and pay. Fine no 3 for me in just over three years, all deserved.

How long do you get to pay? Thinking now about others experiences it could easily come when we are on holidays? You must get 30 days?
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  #26  
Old 12.12.2012, 00:16
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Re: Fine for driving 52 km/hr

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Good point of this thread is that some quite precise info came out of it.

What however I don't understand very well is that quite often I get the impression that asking institutional offices would be considered a shame, asking for proof rather illicit and making an appeal a terrible crime.

In such case I personally would have made a phone call to the issuing office and cleared things up (my doubts, how much speed, given proofs, maybe rights and duties). Depending on the outcome, one could always still consider a possible appeal.

I mean this still is a democracy ...
Yes, you can indeed, but you'll get charged the time it takes them for the additional processing. So either admit you were over when doing 55 kph and pay the 40 CHF or deny deny deny and pay 40 CHF + 250 CHF "admin fee". Simple economy really. Democracy ain't free...
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  #27  
Old 12.12.2012, 00:17
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Re: Fine for driving 52 km/hr

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I`ll take up the challenge. Coming back out of Luzern tonight where I don`t go so often I was just driving along following traffic and then two quick flashes in front, I took my foot off the accelerator quickly but there was a 3rd flash.

Assume that`s 3 of us that caught. I was probably 88 (speedo) in an 80km. Given the tolerances it could be registered as 1 or 2 km over. I will shut up and pay. Fine no 3 for me in just over three years, all deserved.

How long do you get to pay? Thinking now about others experiences it could easily come when we are on holidays? You must get 30 days?
3rd flash but not a 4th, usually there is a double flash? You might get lucky!!
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  #28  
Old 12.12.2012, 00:19
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Re: Fine for driving 52 km/hr

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One day maybe some will post on EF that they got a tickets and they were in the wrong.
I just paid my speeding ticket that I got in France. I was speeding. I got flashed.

Guilty as charged.
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  #29  
Old 12.12.2012, 00:23
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Re: Fine for driving 52 km/hr

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Yes, you can indeed, but you'll get charged the time it takes them for the additional processing. So either admit you were over when doing 55 kph and pay the 40 CHF or deny deny deny and pay ...
...
Why "deny"? I might have got it wrong that OP wasn't even aware of going 55 ... but .... in case of doubt or honest childish interest, why should it be forbidden to ask those things directly at the office, including for the info on which type of proof/technical appliance has been used, if?

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...
Democracy ain't free...
Phone call cost.
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  #30  
Old 12.12.2012, 00:26
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Re: Fine for driving 52 km/hr

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You mean they wouldn't be able to tell me at what speed I was going and if it were a laser or a picture taken as a proof?


Btw yes, also what you got from what I could have meant actually might do the trick in some issues. This is Switzerland after all, not Germany or Italy. Much more bargaining power and space to interpretation of a given situation
Let me make it simple...
  • Speeding
  • Laser
  • Flash
  • Picture
  • Invoice
  • Guilty
You must have a VERY strong case to argue a speeding fine. This is not a good opportunity to challenge and bargain. Your discussion will fall on deaf ears.

Aware of speeding or not... you are responsible for a ton of killing material.
JC
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  #31  
Old 12.12.2012, 00:27
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Re: Fine for driving 52 km/hr

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I just paid my speeding ticket that I got in France. I was speeding. I got flashed.

Guilty as charged.
With all the camera`s around this could turn into a VERY long thread.
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  #32  
Old 12.12.2012, 08:50
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Re: Fine for driving 52 km/hr

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Laser cameras remove 3 km/h - older radar cameras remove 5 km/h due to less accuracy.

10 percent tolerance in your speedometer is only a rule of thumb. My old car had 14-15 km/h difference at 120 km/h. Whereas my new car has only 9 km/h difference at the same speed measured with the same GPS. So, actually, the speedometer of the car displayed a much higher speed than clocked by the laser/radar. My guess between 58 and 62.
Shame on you Vlad.
JC
When you get your MFK done that will tell you the difference on the speedo to reality (In canton Zurich, I don't know about other test centres.)
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  #33  
Old 12.12.2012, 08:56
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Re: Fine for driving 52 km/hr

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How can you unknowingly do 62 in a 50???
Easy. How about the road between Neuch and Biel. 50 and 60's alternate almost at random on a road that could handle traffic at 80 most of the way.
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  #34  
Old 12.12.2012, 09:09
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Re: Fine for driving 52 km/hr

I have been Switzerlanded like this too. 2 kph over the limit but as mentioned by others this is after they knock a couple of kph off. Fine is pretty trivial and you could pay it at get an inner glow of satisfaction when you really abuse the speed limit in the future and get away with it.
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  #35  
Old 12.12.2012, 09:16
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Re: Fine for driving 52 km/hr

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Thank you. This was a solid explanation which convinces me NOT to write any appeal.
I simply don't understand the aggressiveness of others who blindly groan.
The reason they blindly groan is that they are bored and have nothing better to do and know full well their opinion is not even valid. They should actually be reported and blocked since a groan should not be allowed without providing a valid and reasoned recommendation for why it was given
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  #36  
Old 12.12.2012, 09:29
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Re: Fine for driving 52 km/hr

How do speeding fines work in Switzerland? <--- I think litespeed's post should be made a sticky, or its contents added to the first post of the Q&A sticky that's already there :-)
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  #37  
Old 12.12.2012, 09:32
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Re: Fine for driving 52 km/hr

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Easy. How about the road between Neuch and Biel. 50 and 60's alternate almost at random on a road that could handle traffic at 80 most of the way.
That road is a complete PITA. There are short stretches of 80,60, and 50 ( mostly 80 and 60 IIRC) all the way along that road so you're in a constant cycle of braking and accelerating which IMO is more dangerous than maintaining a constant speed as if you're watching the speedo you're not paying as much attention to the road and other potential hazards.
They must make a fortune on that road alone as the cameras are constantly flashing.
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  #38  
Old 12.12.2012, 10:02
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Re: Fine for driving 52 km/hr

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When you get your MFK done that will tell you the difference on the speedo to reality (In canton Zurich, I don't know about other test centres.)
I had my speedometer (car is a 2004 Audi A3) checked for accuracy during the MFK - was suprisingly out, across the whole scale. I don't have the info with me, but it was displaying something like 55/56 kmh at a road speed of 50kmh. On average, it over-reads by ca. 10%, the smallest margin being at around 60kmh.

This is normal for cars. My last car was also the same.

You can even calculate the speedo error on a spreadsheet, if you know all the gear ratios, tyre sizes and final drive ratio; assuming the tacho is more accurate than the speedo, which I suspect it is.

Armed with this information, I don't have much sympathy at all for those who jump around like a pea on a drum about being stung for being 1 or 2 units of velocity over the limit. If I got a speeding fine for 51km/h, then I know my speedo would have, at the time, been indicating fractionally more than 60km/h ([i.e. (51+3)*56/50]. And thus, only myself to blame (which has happened to me three times in 10 years, equating to 14 pints of beer)

For the case where cameras are placed at a particular locations where the revenue could be theoretically maximised - sorry, even then, no excuse. You don't see train drivers deliberately exceeding the set speed limit because it's a clear day with nothing else on the track and no passengers on the train, do you?
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  #39  
Old 12.12.2012, 10:04
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Re: Fine for driving 52 km/hr

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The reason they blindly groan is that they are bored and have nothing better to do and know full well their opinion is not even valid. They should actually be reported and blocked since a groan should not be allowed without providing a valid and reasoned recommendation for why it was given
EF should charge an admin fee for querying groans. It would make a fortune
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  #40  
Old 12.12.2012, 10:21
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Re: Fine for driving 52 km/hr

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Thank you. This was a solid explanation which convinces me NOT to write any appeal.
I simply don't understand the aggressiveness of others who blindly groan.
Maybe they're groaning because we've done this topic to death in the past.
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