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Old 04.01.2006, 17:50
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Public transport with a buggy

Is it only me who thinks it's weird that people stood waiting to get on the tram/bus/train will let a mother with a kid has to practically bounce down the steps before the two strong men either side of the door bothered to help as I was trying to get around them to help.

This officially follows on from the Zurich driving thread.

Hupp SZ!
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Old 13.01.2006, 09:27
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Re: Public transport with a buggy

Interesting. I remember my girlfriend always complained that when she was walking on crutches nobody ever gave her a seat on a tram, and she often sees elderly people or heavily pregnant women standing while adults (and often children) occupy the seats.

Just after reading your message we were on holiday in Sydney and caught a bus. We stood open-jawed as passengers gave up seats to elderly people. A man who was a little feeble was assisted by two other passengers to board and disembark. On a short bus ride we must have witnessed more than 10 acts of kindness. Now many readers might ask why we should be so shocked to see strangers being so nice to each other. Indeed - maybe we should ask ourselves why we were so shocked, but I think we all know the answer to that one...

I did see a sign with a code of conduct for school children using public transport. School kids are given passes by the government to use public transport to and from school for free. If they are caught annoying other passengers (loud music, shouting, boisterous behaviour, not giving up seats to an adult) their passes are revoked and their parents will have to pay for them to travel to school.

So as not to limit this thread to the Swiss, I've often witnessed similair (poor) behaviour on London's public transport system - often on the tube it's every man for himself!

Mark
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Old 13.01.2006, 09:42
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Re: Public transport with a buggy

I had quite some time with a broken leg; not only did people try to barge me back up the steps on the tram but they would attempt to walk through me on the street.

One guy even walked into me in a store and was ready to get upset with me when he saw my yellow crutches......and the fact that I was standing still.

Thankfully, I'm 6'+ and 100kg+....people don't want to mess with me
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Old 13.01.2006, 12:15
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Re: Public transport with a buggy

Quote:
So as not to limit this thread to the Swiss, I've often witnessed similair (poor) behaviour on London's public transport system - often on the tube it's every man for himself!
Now lets get this right Mark, between 06:30 and ca 09:00 and similarly 16:00 till 18:30 every day it is open warfare on the London tube system!! But I have got to admit how amazed I am to see a different as in totally different attitude taken on the buses.

Do you think it is something to do with people on the buses generally not been of the same status as many on the tube and those in the "higher" status on the tube thinking they are important? That might explain the Swiss attitude as well - not meaning that in an anti-Swiss way but the public transport system here is second probably only to Japan and therefore you get many people using it that would not in other countries...
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Old 16.01.2006, 20:53
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Re: Public transport with a buggy

Actually on the subject of Japan I stood open jawed as the people on the crowded commuter train moved back to let me in, and then moved back around me as the doors closed. It was as if I was Moses parting the waters of the Red Sea. Mind you I have no way of knowing whether everyone gets that service there, or whether it was the fact that I'm a 6"4' round-eyes that did the trick!

Was getting on a bus at Davos this afternoon and a whole pile of school kids virtually stormed the bus, almost trampling the few little old ladies who were trying to get off. I yelled out at them, and a couple stopped, but most ignored me. Next time I'm going to grab the little buggers by the back of the collar until the passengers have got off the bus. The driver did nothing, lack of manners seems to be the norm these days...

Mark
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Old 17.01.2006, 09:20
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Re: Public transport with a buggy

Mark - only in the Swiss-German region

Actually, I've just moved out of ZH to SZ; people there seem much nicer too....easier-going, more likely to help and be flexible
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Old 05.02.2006, 12:05
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Re: Public transport with a buggy

I may be a bit late in a reply on this one, but it is something that has really frustrated me over the past weeks. I cannot drive and am completely reliant on public transport to get anywhere (am in Villars-Sur-Glane-Fribourg). I have a small child who is too heavy for me too carry, but as yet unable to walk so am always pushing a buggy. The buggy in question is extremely narrow, small and lightweight, but yet there are buses and trains in the region (about 40% or so) that are physically impossible for me to get on without help. Another 30% or so are accessible when I physically lift the buggy and child up or down a flight of steps and the rest are the buggy friendly buses.
Very few people have thus far helped me, even when obviously struggling to lift and carry the buggy on and off, and school children barrel on with no thought, I have in fact missed my stop on several occassions due to being physically unable to get the buggy off the bus against the stream of incoming teens.
On several occasions people have actually got off at other doors in order to avoid having to help me,or I have received assistance from elderly (and I mean elderly) men, putting younger men who just hopped off to shame. On one occasion I was visibly struggling with the buggy and a heavy bag of shopping but the group of young men waiting to get on, looked at me and continued their conversation.
I have to say, one bus driver leapt out of his cab, ran to the doors and helped me off, but it was the end of the line and he had a ten minutes wait (sorry, cynical, but I did appreciate it). Other women with buggies/children have helped me in exchange, but again this event is rare. It makes me so cross as in the UK, even when I struggled on the bus, sometimes having to fold the pushchair, I received plenty of assistance in getting off.
Sorry about the rant but am fed up of it.
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Old 05.02.2006, 21:13
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Re: Public transport with a buggy

rant away, I say
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Old 05.02.2006, 22:37
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Re: Public transport with a buggy

Strange, I've been riding the train twice a day to work for 4 years and I've always seen people help women with their carriages.
Mind you.. I usually ride during rush hour, and there's not that many kids there.
What I have seen is some women who just assume everyone will run to their rescue. If they don't look like they need help, I dont really rush over there either. I don't have kids, so maybe I'm a bit cynical about this issue (and if I ever do, I might see the world differently)
But I have seen men with the same size buggy handle it perfectly by themselves, refusing any help.
Why can't we women do that ?
If you can't lift the thing, couldn't you buy a smaller one?

Reminds me of a female friend I went travelling with who couldn't lift her own suitcase (which was bigger than mine!) and expected people (me) to help her with it.

Christina <-- see, I'm a girl, I can bitch about women
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Old 06.02.2006, 10:31
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Re: Public transport with a buggy

OK I've got 2 comments about this. 1st I've noticed that the Swiss are more than happy to help - if you ask them. I think it's a cultural difference - I see someone needing help and offer, and they wait until asked, then are mostly very helpful. I've had experiences of being offered help and of being ignored with my buggy... which leads me to my tangent - what is with the rolls royce buggies here? I've got a tiny, lightweight, maclaren and can, if necessary, carry the buggy with 11kg baby inside down the stairs in the train station by myself. My m-i-l thought I was a freak for buying such a "cheap" buggy. I certainly wouldn't be able to manage the typical monstrous buggy by myself.
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Old 06.02.2006, 18:19
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Re: Public transport with a buggy

Quote:
OK I've got 2 comments about this. 1st I've noticed that the Swiss are more than happy to help - if you ask them. I think it's a cultural difference - I see someone needing help and offer, and they wait until asked, then are mostly very helpful. I've had experiences of being offered help and of being ignored with my buggy... which leads me to my tangent - what is with the rolls royce buggies here? I've got a tiny, lightweight, maclaren and can, if necessary, carry the buggy with 11kg baby inside down the stairs in the train station by myself. My m-i-l thought I was a freak for buying such a "cheap" buggy. I certainly wouldn't be able to manage the typical monstrous buggy by myself.
Interesting thought. I suppose if one is old or has a disability or is standing there on crutches then it would be appropriate to say "excuse me young person/child/more able bodied person, do you think I could sit in that seat instead of you?" My guess is that this isn't going to happen (the asking part that is). Or if that person is struggling to get off they should address the multitutes that are attempting to barge over the top of them to get on the bus "impatient horde! Would you be so kind as to wait until everybody is off the bus/train/tram before getting on".... I know this thread was about transportation of buggies, but I think widening it to people who are less able-bodied is also appropriate.

Also interesting comments about the size of buggies - I must admit that I have seen people attempting to park prams the size of a hummer in some buses - that really is a bit much. Or how about kids which are absolutely enormous - I think to myself "you could get out and help your Mum with that thing!"
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Old 06.02.2006, 18:23
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Re: Public transport with a buggy

Quote:

Christina <-- see, I'm a girl, I can bitch about women
But are you a mother? Hehehe no seriously, it's a shame that if we don't belong to a particular group that we can't get away with making comments outside the group, but we can if we are in the group. In other words, if you are a woman/man/swiss/foreigner then you can "get away with it" when bitching about another woman/man/swiss/foreigner etc...

Mark
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Old 08.02.2006, 17:42
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Re: Public transport with a buggy

But I have seen men with the same size buggy handle it perfectly by themselves, refusing any help.
Why can't we women do that ?
If you can't lift the thing, couldn't you buy a smaller one?
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Old 08.02.2006, 17:47
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Re: Public transport with a buggy

But I have seen men with the same size buggy handle it perfectly by themselves, refusing any help.
Why can't we women do that ?
If you can't lift the thing, couldn't you buy a smaller one?


I meant to agree with the above post!!! Why do the moms here buy such HUGE buggies?! It's not fair to rely on other ppl cos I for one wouldn't want to hurt my back for someone who can't think of how inconvenient it is for other ppl!
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Old 08.02.2006, 19:10
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Re: Public transport with a buggy

No Mark, I'm not a mom.
And if I were to have a baby, I would buy one of those HUGE jogging buggy thingies, which I definately couldn't lift up the train stairs by myself (but knowing me, I would damn well try it ..)(if nobody's watching)(just to prove a point)

Hmm, when living in Canada I often offered my seat to people who looked like they wanted it/could use it. But I wouldn't jump up just because an elderly person passed me by, no. I've also seen elderly people really embarassed because they were offered a seat, I remember one saying "I didn't know I looked that old".

So I guess that's my principle. If the person looks around, makes eye contact or trips and walks unsteadily, I will help, gladly. But if they stand there staring at nothing and expect me to psychically know they need help, I won't!
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Old 09.02.2006, 12:53
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Re: Public transport with a buggy

it makes me laugh when you're in the tram and the oldies glare at you as you have their "chosen" single seat.

Would you move? There are lots of other seats free....
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