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  #61  
Old 23.10.2015, 11:36
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Re: Recommended cars for sale

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But there is a difference: that thing was not designed to look chav, it was designed for racing (with limited success as BMW was doing the same just a wee bit better at the time...). A touring car actually has a spoiler cause it needs it. There is no excuse for the A series...

P.S> I never knew I wanted an Evo, but looking at this...
Raise you

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Old 23.10.2015, 11:44
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Re: Recommended cars for sale

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All in. (that's what you expect from a Mercedes touring car...)

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  #63  
Old 23.10.2015, 11:49
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Re: Recommended cars for sale

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That's hardly a fair comparison to the 190 though - most of that car used to be a Toyota Avensis and I'm pretty sure it runs the TOCA engine (which is a tweaked GM 2.0T). The 190 pictured was a specific homologation special along the lines of the E30 M3 to allow them to go racing in a time when the cars had to be 'production based'. Adam Morgan's A Class races in a series which also includes RWD Audi A4s and a 2.0 turbo Proton Gen-2 so isn't related to the production car in anything other than the basic shape.
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Old 23.10.2015, 11:53
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Re: Recommended cars for sale

Please could you lot provide the Autoscout links for your recommended cars?

Thanks.
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  #65  
Old 23.10.2015, 12:00
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Re: Recommended cars for sale

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The 190 pictured was a specific homologation special along the lines of the E30 M3 to allow them to go racing in a time when the cars had to be 'production based'.
Something that has died because there just isn't the manufacturers backing to do it anymore - and the cars themselves are more removed from their road going siblings.

It is unfair to call the A-class an Avensis underneath - its not. It is fundamentally an A-class shell, caged and seam welded, and then the parts developed for the Avensis (mainly suspension) will have been used. I'd suspect that they also use many of the stock TOCA parts - engine (as you said), steering box etc etc

The argument that there is no place for an A45 could also be applied to the M3/4 - which no longer races in any guise that resembles the production model. The E92 M3 GTS was a perfect case - limited edition racetrack prepped coupe which was based on a car that was never raced (BMW used the Z4 for GT3 racing - now the 6-series. With Alpina using the older 6-series in 4.4-supercharged and then 5.0 N/A guise).

Sit inside any modern touring/GT3 car and you'll realize you are a long long way from the road model.

The A45 exists because that is what Mercedes buyers want. Gone are the days when Mercedes meant epically built saloons - now it means very shouty V8s and long nose super coupes.
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Old 23.10.2015, 12:00
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Re: Recommended cars for sale

On the 7 seater front there are some decent deals on the Nissan X-Trail new at the moment - a few k discount, 0% leasing and zero downpayment, or the same deal on a Qashqai if you want something practical but can manage with only five seats.

http://www2.nissan.ch/angebote/couch...s_ab_1_Okt.pdf

A top spec 4x4 diesel Qashqai at 485 per month with no deposit is a pretty decent deal, as is a basic X-Trail at under 400.
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  #67  
Old 23.10.2015, 12:07
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Re: Recommended cars for sale

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Something that has died because there just isn't the manufacturers backing to do it anymore - and the cars themselves are more removed from their road going siblings.

It is unfair to call the A-class an Avensis underneath - its not. It is fundamentally an A-class shell, caged and seam welded, and then the parts developed for the Avensis (mainly suspension) will have been used. I'd suspect that they also use many of the stock TOCA parts - engine (as you said), steering box etc etc

The argument that there is no place for an A45 could also be applied to the M3/4 - which no longer races in any guise that resembles the production model. The E92 M3 GTS was a perfect case - limited edition racetrack prepped coupe which was based on a car that was never raced (BMW used the Z4 for GT3 racing - now the 6-series. With Alpina using the older 6-series in 4.4-supercharged and then 5.0 N/A guise).

Sit inside any modern touring/GT3 car and you'll realize you are a long long way from the road model.

The A45 exists because that is what Mercedes buyers want. Gone are the days when Mercedes meant epically built saloons - now it means very shouty V8s and long nose super coupes.
My point was just that you compared the A45 to the 190 2.5, I was being a bit 'tabloid' and facetious saying it's actually a mix of Toyota and Vauxhall, but the 190 is a thinly veiled racing car with numberplates

It's actually not even a full 'shell' as the front subframe and suspension is a TOCA part which attaches to the bulkhead so only the cabin area is left.

I'm a big fan of the A45 AMG (spec dependent, you can make one look hideous), it's properly fast and the noise is addictive, if a little uncouth. I'm not knocking the need for this kind of car, of course the car makers build what people want to buy and it's great that there are some decent performance cars which can be used as a daily driver too.

I wish they'd stop building stuff like the BMW 116d M Sport, or the Merc B180 CDi auto AMG Sport rental car I had last week but sadly there are customers for them too...
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Old 23.10.2015, 12:08
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Re: Recommended cars for sale

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http://www2.nissan.ch/angebote/couch...s_ab_1_Okt.pdf

A top spec 4x4 diesel Qashqai at 485 per month with no deposit is a pretty decent deal, as is a basic X-Trail at under 400.
Pricing on the 370z is very good.

EDIT:

Nothing gets my back up more than "Its a race car for the road" or "Its at home on the road as much on the track" - NO IT BLOOMIN' WELL ISN'T

Race cars are bloody horrendous to drive in the normal road - they are noisy, uncomfortable, lacking any creature comforts and very dangerous (unless you wear a helmet). Roads car are rubbish on track - no matter how stiff you think the car is the moment you really go for it you realize just how much the damn thing rolls, spring rates are all wrong for riding kerbs and you have to spend a huge amount of energy bracing yourself. They are always too heavy, they always have too much weight transfer and they always driven by people who think that because the marketing people said it will excel on track it will actually be able to keep a proper race car behind.
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Old 23.10.2015, 12:18
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Re: Recommended cars for sale

Not a car to recommend, but a question on used cars: How long do composite ceramic brakes last? The discussions online seem rather emotional with little facts... some love them, others complain that they are noisy when cold - all I see is a massive price tag if I have to replace discs.

Some manufacturers say they last "up to 250k km" but we all know what this "up to" can mean... anyone has some and needed to replace them? At what kms?
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Old 23.10.2015, 12:28
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Re: Recommended cars for sale

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Pricing on the 370z is very good.

EDIT:

Nothing gets my back up more than "Its a race car for the road" or "Its at home on the road as much on the track" - NO IT BLOOMIN' WELL ISN'T
Tax is punitive on the 370Z if you live in ZH though - 2k+ per year. Having said that though, is it now CO2 based instead of engine size? I just remember being upset I couldn't get a Cayenne S because of silly annual tax rates but maybe the post 2013 rules changed that?

I agree totally on the 'race car for the road'. With the exception of a few seriously hardcore drivers cars (GT3 RS, Caterham R500, Lotus Exige) it isn't true, and when it is true it isn't a good thing!
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Old 23.10.2015, 14:12
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Re: Recommended cars for sale

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Not a car to recommend, but a question on used cars: How long do composite ceramic brakes last? The discussions online seem rather emotional with little facts... some love them, others complain that they are noisy when cold - all I see is a massive price tag if I have to replace discs.

Some manufacturers say they last "up to 250k km" but we all know what this "up to" can mean... anyone has some and needed to replace them? At what kms?
Ceramic brakes are rubbish unless you do about 20 hard, and i mean hard brakings before you really want to use them.

I had them on my car (E63) and i had them changed back to normal brakes.
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  #72  
Old 23.10.2015, 14:31
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Re: Recommended cars for sale

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Ceramic brakes are rubbish unless you do about 20 hard, and i mean hard brakings before you really want to use them.

I had them on my car (E63) and i had them changed back to normal brakes.
EVO magazine did a test recently and they showed that traditional ones worked best for the first couple of runs - then they were even - and then the metal ones faded.
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Old 23.10.2015, 14:55
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Re: Recommended cars for sale

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EVO magazine did a test recently and they showed that traditional ones worked best for the first couple of runs - then they were even - and then the metal ones faded.
Now they must have studied really hard to figure that out... but anyway - I am not planning to do any track days, but it's simply a fact that Swiss people tend to tick any box they find on an options list... so more and more used cars (of the more powerful kind) show up in my searches which have them. Looks like the risk of ending up repairing some 15k CHF set of brakes is too high for what you get.

Funny that a very expensive upgrade therefore actually lowers your resell value instead of increasing it...
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Old 23.10.2015, 14:56
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Re: Recommended cars for sale

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Now they must have studied really hard to figure that out... but anyway - I am not planning to do any track days, but it's simply a fact that Swiss people tend to tick any box they find on an options list... so more and more used cars (of the more powerful kind) show up in my searches which have them. Looks like the risk of ending up repairing some 15k CHF set of brakes is too high for what you get.

Funny that a very expensive upgrade therefore actually lowers your resell value instead of increasing it...
Actually, it's easy to swap back to normal brakes - just a change of pads and discs, so it isn't the end of the world if you don't like them.
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Old 23.10.2015, 15:10
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Re: Recommended cars for sale

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Tax is punitive on the 370Z if you live in ZH though - 2k+ per year. Having said that though, is it now CO2 based instead of engine size? I just remember being upset I couldn't get a Cayenne S because of silly annual tax rates but maybe the post 2013 rules changed that?
What? I pay a little more than 1k for a 4.3lt 2.3 ton land-yacht so that can't be true.

http://www.stva.zh.ch/internet/siche...BvaAUTO14.html

Tax for the 370z doesn't even touch 1k.

It's displacement and gross weight dependent, so yes a big SUV will get shafted, but the 370z is quite reasonable.



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Now they must have studied really hard to figure that out... but anyway - I am not planning to do any track days, but it's simply a fact that Swiss people tend to tick any box they find on an options list... so more and more used cars (of the more powerful kind) show up in my searches which have them. Looks like the risk of ending up repairing some 15k CHF set of brakes is too high for what you get.

Funny that a very expensive upgrade therefore actually lowers your resell value instead of increasing it...
Ceramic discs can easily do 150k Km even with regular tracking. Pads might last longer than standard ones, but they're not much more expensive than "conventional" so who cares really.

Also I've recently driven a 430 with ceramics and it was pretty good in city traffic. I didn't notice anything wrong with the bite. A while ago a quick drive in an R8 was also fine, but the car was warm when I got in the driver's seat...
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Old 23.10.2015, 15:39
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Re: Recommended cars for sale

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Ceramic brakes are rubbish unless you do about 20 hard, and i mean hard brakings before you really want to use them.

I had them on my car (E63) and i had them changed back to normal brakes.
Ceramic brakes last longer and provide a much lower rotating mass, consequently also lower total mass. They are expensive, that's true, but they make a hell of a difference after just two laps in a track day in Monza...

Last edited by Capo; 23.10.2015 at 15:50.
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Old 23.10.2015, 16:06
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Re: Recommended cars for sale

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Ceramic brakes last longer and provide a much lower rotating mass, consequently also lower total mass. They are expensive, that's true, but they make a hell of a difference after just two laps in a track day in Monza...
Understood. Unfortunately is the morning traffic jam on the A3 not exactly the same as tracking Monza...
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Old 23.10.2015, 22:41
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Re: Recommended cars for sale

Just came across this fabulous thread !!
Thanks, Dodgyken !!
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  #79  
Old 02.11.2015, 08:50
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Re: Recommended cars for sale

Just to show that you can add a little bling to your life at the budget end, the fabled "drop-top compressor" ("Favourite Things" by Big Brovaz) - that is one of many, with MFK under 5k and in a good colour combination. Maybe not the best winter car - but if you a city driver the hard-top will work well. One of the few convertibles that can live outside in winter.

Meanwhile DKs Saab watch is throwing up more and more <5k cars - with mid-plate (06) TID 9-3s appearing within budget. The 9-5 2.3t is still the one to have though.

In terms of legendary status the Volvo 240 is up there with the best. Prices rose around 10 years ago and 5k is going to be the entry point for a good one. Tailgate rust is their Achilles heel - but they are a doddle to work on if you have the facilities. If you're lucky you'll still be able to find the OEM full length roof rack giving the car an insane luggage capacity!! This one seems rust free (based on photos of the known fail points). The main "problem" is replacing the stereo in these as getting hold of dash panel was hard enough 10+ years ago. There is plenty of space under the boot though for a tidy install if you know what you are doing.

The Volvo 960 was the last "proper" Volvo estate (IE RWD - the V90 was merely a name change!). This might be worth taking up the road to TCS for a check.

The people carrier of choice has now dipped under the 5k mark too - XC90 - yes it needs an MFK, has clocked plenty of KMs and has the less desirable petrol engine - but I reckon that still has plenty of life left in it.
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Old 02.11.2015, 08:56
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Re: Recommended cars for sale

I wouldn't touch that XC90 with someone else's ten foot bargepole personally. The gearboxes are a bit fragile at the best of times and unless you can afford to spend the purchase price of the car again in repairs in fairly short order my people-moving 5k would go on a Zafira, Grand Scenic or other similar misery-bus.

I do find that 240 strangely tempting, if rather expensive, though.
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