Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Help & tips > Transportation/driving  
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 15.05.2017, 22:07
pkb pkb is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Schwyz
Posts: 77
Groaned at 5 Times in 4 Posts
Thanked 14 Times in 10 Posts
pkb has earned some respectpkb has earned some respect
Insurance for visitor driving my car?

My brother-in-law is visiting us and he'll use my car to travel around in switzerland. I wonder if he needs to purchase any insurance for that purpose? My car already has mandatory car insurance but I'm not sure if that only applies to me as a driver?

Thanks
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 15.05.2017, 22:27
curley's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: canton ZH
Posts: 11,502
Groaned at 183 Times in 151 Posts
Thanked 12,914 Times in 6,750 Posts
curley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Insurance for visitor driving my car?

Quote:
View Post
My brother-in-law is visiting us and he'll use my car to travel around in switzerland. I wonder if he needs to purchase any insurance for that purpose? My car already has mandatory car insurance but I'm not sure if that only applies to me as a driver?

Thanks
It's tricky nowadays apparantly. See here (sorry German).
Why not call your insurance and check it properly?
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 15.05.2017, 23:01
st2lemans's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Lugano
Posts: 29,165
Groaned at 2,043 Times in 1,527 Posts
Thanked 34,719 Times in 16,494 Posts
st2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Insurance for visitor driving my car?

Quote:
View Post
It's tricky nowadays apparantly. See here (sorry German).
Why not call your insurance and check it properly?
Rubbish.

They are insured, higher deductable if a new driver, end of.

Tom
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank st2lemans for this useful post:
  #4  
Old 15.05.2017, 23:19
curley's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: canton ZH
Posts: 11,502
Groaned at 183 Times in 151 Posts
Thanked 12,914 Times in 6,750 Posts
curley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Insurance for visitor driving my car?

Quote:
View Post
Rubbish.

They are insured, higher deductable if a new driver, end of.

Tom
It's not what it says on the comparis site. And I do remember it was tricky ages ago. Yes, the insurance pays but they "nehmen Regress" to the driver (go back to the driver to repay the costs).
It is safe for who ever you hit/hurt. But not for the driver who lent the car more than one time. If the driver lives in the same household they just assume it's done more often (which would not be the case for OP).

And the same with the private liability insurance (which would come in to pay the car-insurance back). Regular lending is a no-no and they're good at claiming it is regular.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 15.05.2017, 23:53
st2lemans's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Lugano
Posts: 29,165
Groaned at 2,043 Times in 1,527 Posts
Thanked 34,719 Times in 16,494 Posts
st2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Insurance for visitor driving my car?

If a visitor crashes your car more than once, you have other problems.

Tom
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank st2lemans for this useful post:
  #6  
Old 16.05.2017, 00:02
curley's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: canton ZH
Posts: 11,502
Groaned at 183 Times in 151 Posts
Thanked 12,914 Times in 6,750 Posts
curley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Insurance for visitor driving my car?

Quote:
View Post
If a visitor crashes your car more than once, you have other problems.

Tom
Working hard on misunderstanding me?

I do think the OP's question is important But we can always wait for aSwissinUS
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank curley for this useful post:
  #7  
Old 16.05.2017, 00:06
st2lemans's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Lugano
Posts: 29,165
Groaned at 2,043 Times in 1,527 Posts
Thanked 34,719 Times in 16,494 Posts
st2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Insurance for visitor driving my car?

Quote:
View Post
Working hard on misunderstanding me?

I do think the OP's question is important But we can always wait for aSwissinUS
In 30+ years of lending out my vehicles, no crashes, and only one speeding ticket.

Lending less than once a year does not make me a habitual lender.

Tom
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank st2lemans for this useful post:
  #8  
Old 16.05.2017, 00:20
curley's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: canton ZH
Posts: 11,502
Groaned at 183 Times in 151 Posts
Thanked 12,914 Times in 6,750 Posts
curley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Insurance for visitor driving my car?

Quote:
View Post
In 30+ years of lending out my vehicles, no crashes, and only one speeding ticket.

Lending less than once a year does not make me a habitual lender.

Tom
But it's not about the owner of the car lending regularly. It's about the one who lends it!
Did you read the comparis-page I linked? You speak German!

I just noticed «Führen fremder Motorfahrzeuge» can be included in the private liability insurance here and - I have to check - but I think I personally have that. But OP's brother is ..... English? ..... no idea what insurance he has.

The OP can't really do anything in advance, his brother has to.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 16.05.2017, 01:26
Ace1's Avatar
A modal singularity
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Morgins, VS (and Alsace)
Posts: 8,527
Groaned at 346 Times in 221 Posts
Thanked 14,237 Times in 6,241 Posts
Ace1 has a reputation beyond reputeAce1 has a reputation beyond reputeAce1 has a reputation beyond reputeAce1 has a reputation beyond reputeAce1 has a reputation beyond reputeAce1 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Insurance for visitor driving my car?

Quote:
View Post
But it's not about the owner of the car lending regularly. It's about the one who lends it!
You need to be a bit better in your English before accusing folks of 'deliberately' misunderstanding you. It is the owner of the car who is the one who lends it to someone else.
Quote:
View Post
The OP can't really do anything in advance, his brother has to.
Nothing to be done. As Tom already stated the car is insured for anyone to drive. The OP asks if he's OK to lend it to his BiL, the answer is an unqualified yes. Neither he nor the BiL need any additional insurance.

The page you linked seems (to my B1 German) to be suggesting additional types of cover you could take out when borrowing someone else's car, to avoid having to cover additional losses, e.g. the excess (franchise) or a loss of no claims benefit. Well sure, in the event of an accident somebody may be out of pocket, but that's nothing different whether it's the owner or the borrower who has the accident.
__________________
http://www.chaletbeauroc.com
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank Ace1 for this useful post:
  #10  
Old 16.05.2017, 08:34
dodgyken's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Democratic Republic Kenistan
Posts: 10,690
Groaned at 281 Times in 232 Posts
Thanked 19,403 Times in 7,402 Posts
dodgyken has a reputation beyond reputedodgyken has a reputation beyond reputedodgyken has a reputation beyond reputedodgyken has a reputation beyond reputedodgyken has a reputation beyond reputedodgyken has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Insurance for visitor driving my car?

I have had (twice) lengthy conversations with regards to naming people on insurance - but both companies wanted nothing to do with English logic of naming people who drive the car - unless they "drive the vehicle frequently"

It does make life a whole lot easier - but if the OP is coming from a "named driver" style insurance I can understand the question
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank dodgyken for this useful post:
  #11  
Old 16.05.2017, 10:32
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Ostschweiz
Posts: 8,050
Groaned at 349 Times in 283 Posts
Thanked 10,413 Times in 5,501 Posts
Urs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Insurance for visitor driving my car?

Quote:
View Post
Nothing to be done. As Tom already stated the car is insured for anyone to drive. The OP asks if he's OK to lend it to his BiL, the answer is an unqualified yes.
Except it's anythinng but. OP asks about "any" insurance whereas Tom appears to speak about 3rd party liability only.

There are three types of potential damage/cost here:
i) 3rd party damage caused by the car, e.g. a fence or pedestrian you hit
ii) damage to the borrowed car
iii) OP's potential insurance premium increase and deductible as a result of payment for i)

Coverage thereof:
i) is covered by the car's 3rd party insurance, as Tom said already
ii) unknown. Perhaps covered by BiL's 3rd party insurance, perhaps not, assuming he has 3rd party in the first place. If he had Swiss 3rd party liability it would, according to this page by Mobiliar Versicherungen, be excluded by most insurers, at any rate subject to T&C.
iii) unknown. Would be covered by the borrower's 3rd party insurance if he was Swiss and unless explicitly excluded so Swiss residents should check their T&C. But BiL is foreign so also unknown.

Bottom line:
OP, ask your insurance and have your BiL ask his. It may be a good idea to not just phone but rather, get it in writing.

Slightly oT yet perhaps worth your time:
One thing that hasn't been mentioned yet is damage without a "real" accident, be that the car breaking down or a broken windshield. The latter would be covered by Teilkasko but OP mentions mandatory insurance only hence s/he may have no Teilkasko insurance. Who pays for a broken side mirror or a scratch may be worth talking about as well.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank Urs Max for this useful post:
  #12  
Old 16.05.2017, 10:56
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Mies
Posts: 873
Groaned at 13 Times in 9 Posts
Thanked 626 Times in 359 Posts
catandmouse is considered knowledgeablecatandmouse is considered knowledgeablecatandmouse is considered knowledgeable
Re: Insurance for visitor driving my car?

There's a fundmental difference between the way car insurance works in the UK and here. In the UK, you insure the driver, who is authorised to drive a particular car. Here in Switzerland it's the car that is insured, so anyone is authorised to drive it. The policy may include named or family members, but other drivers are likely to have a higher excess.
Reply With Quote
The following 4 users would like to thank catandmouse for this useful post:
  #13  
Old 16.05.2017, 11:04
Ace1's Avatar
A modal singularity
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Morgins, VS (and Alsace)
Posts: 8,527
Groaned at 346 Times in 221 Posts
Thanked 14,237 Times in 6,241 Posts
Ace1 has a reputation beyond reputeAce1 has a reputation beyond reputeAce1 has a reputation beyond reputeAce1 has a reputation beyond reputeAce1 has a reputation beyond reputeAce1 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Insurance for visitor driving my car?

Quote:
View Post

Nothing to be done. As Tom already stated the car is insured for anyone to drive.
Quote:
View Post
Except it's anything but. OP asks about "any" insurance whereas Tom appears to speak about 3rd party liability only.
Perhaps you're misunderstand the OP's questions, although they seemed quite clear to me. He's not asking about what risks may be involved, or whether additional cover might be a good idea, just what is the legal requirement.

Quote:
View Post
I wonder if he needs to purchase any insurance for that purpose?
No, he does not.

Quote:
View Post
My car already has mandatory car insurance but I'm not sure if that only applies to me as a driver?
No, it covers the car, not the driver, so anyone can drive.
Reply With Quote
The following 4 users would like to thank Ace1 for this useful post:
  #14  
Old 16.05.2017, 11:15
aSwissInTheUS's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Zurich area
Posts: 12,288
Groaned at 97 Times in 86 Posts
Thanked 18,774 Times in 8,323 Posts
aSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Insurance for visitor driving my car?

I fully agree with Urs. Thank you for all the typing.

As he says you have to look at the problem from two sides of view. From the car owner and from the potential driver. And then additionally depending on what kind of damage my occur.

From legal point of view, as long as the car has the mandatory liability insurance everything is good. But there is also the personal point of view. That what Urs is writing about.

Quote:
View Post
It's not what it says on the comparis site. And I do remember it was tricky ages ago. Yes, the insurance pays but they "nehmen Regress" to the driver (go back to the driver to repay the costs).
The liability insurance will always pay as the insurance is linked to plate and car. By law the insurance must pay. The insurance can only recoup its cost from the driver in case of gross negligence. In some case it must recoup the cost by law (Art. 65 SVG).

Strassenverkehrsgesetz https://www.admin.ch/opc/de/classifi...266/index.html
Verkehrsversicherungsverordnung https://www.admin.ch/opc/de/classifi...239/index.html
__________________
"Okay, I just hope we don't wake up on Mars or something surrounded by millions of little squashy guys."
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank aSwissInTheUS for this useful post:
  #15  
Old 16.05.2017, 11:43
curley's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: canton ZH
Posts: 11,502
Groaned at 183 Times in 151 Posts
Thanked 12,914 Times in 6,750 Posts
curley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Insurance for visitor driving my car?

Quote:
View Post
I fully agree with Urs. Thank you for all the typing.

As he says you have to look at the problem from two sides of view. From the car owner and from the potential driver. And then additionally depending on what kind of damage my occur.

From legal point of view, as long as the car has the mandatory liability insurance everything is good. But there is also the personal point of view. That what Urs is writing about.



The liability insurance will always pay as the insurance is linked to plate and car. By law the insurance must pay. The insurance can only recoup its cost from the driver in case of gross negligence. In some case it must recoup the cost by law (Art. 65 SVG).

Strassenverkehrsgesetz https://www.admin.ch/opc/de/classifi...266/index.html
Verkehrsversicherungsverordnung https://www.admin.ch/opc/de/classifi...239/index.html
Correct.
But the increase of the insurance-fee (if not insured by OP .... gosh that's gonna start an other discussion) either the private liability insurance of the BIL covers (and THAT'S where the tricky thing is at least for Swiss insurances) or OP has to just live with it.

Hoping that the 99% of the people who usually understand my poor English here will know what I mean
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 16.05.2017, 12:10
aSwissInTheUS's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Zurich area
Posts: 12,288
Groaned at 97 Times in 86 Posts
Thanked 18,774 Times in 8,323 Posts
aSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Insurance for visitor driving my car?

Quote:
View Post
Correct.
But the increase of the insurance-fee (if not insured by OP .... gosh that's gonna start an other discussion) either the private liability insurance of the BIL covers (and THAT'S where the tricky thing is at least for Swiss insurances) or OP has to just live with it.
Or BiL just pays the difference of the premium hike out of his own pocket. Just discuss that all before the drive so everyone is on the same page.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank aSwissInTheUS for this useful post:
  #17  
Old 16.05.2017, 14:19
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Greater Zürich Area
Posts: 921
Groaned at 119 Times in 76 Posts
Thanked 701 Times in 388 Posts
EPMike has an excellent reputationEPMike has an excellent reputationEPMike has an excellent reputationEPMike has an excellent reputation
Re: Insurance for visitor driving my car?

Quote:
View Post
In 30+ years of lending out my vehicles, no crashes, and only one speeding ticket.

Lending less than once a year does not make me a habitual lender.

Tom
Wow, that is a good track record. I was in CH for only a few months when I gave my brother my car for one single day and he managed to crash it
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank EPMike for this useful post:
  #18  
Old 16.05.2017, 16:33
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Ostschweiz
Posts: 8,050
Groaned at 349 Times in 283 Posts
Thanked 10,413 Times in 5,501 Posts
Urs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Insurance for visitor driving my car?

Quote:
View Post
Perhaps you're misunderstand the OP's questions, although they seemed quite clear to me. He's not asking about what risks may be involved, or whether additional cover might be a good idea, just what is the legal requirement.
You're right, in a verbatim sense it's not what OP asked. Sometimes though people don't know what question to ask to get the info they may want or need, this may be such a case.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 16.05.2017, 18:23
eng_ch's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Up where the air is clear
Posts: 1,646
Groaned at 4 Times in 4 Posts
Thanked 1,596 Times in 813 Posts
eng_ch has a reputation beyond reputeeng_ch has a reputation beyond reputeeng_ch has a reputation beyond reputeeng_ch has a reputation beyond reputeeng_ch has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Insurance for visitor driving my car?

According to the Comparis article, if your cover is fully comp, then there is no issue except who pays the excess and any increase in premium (hint: the car owner is legally fully within their rights to claim these off the person who borrowed the car if they caused the accident). It's only if your cover is less than fully comp that other issues arise.
Reply With Quote
Reply




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Is my car sufficient for driving in Holland ? Today only Transportation/driving 32 04.01.2017 17:27
Car Insurance for my UK Car tamplip01 Insurance 13 26.02.2013 08:53
Insurance for collecting & driving a 2nd hand car in France Guest Transportation/driving 3 09.06.2012 12:58
Friend received a car parking ticket whilst driving my car, leaving to the UK soon? TestingTheWater Transportation/driving 6 19.07.2011 19:44
health insurance for visitor (with visitor visa) kar Permits/visas/government 2 25.04.2008 02:56


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 01:24.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0