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Old 20.03.2019, 12:02
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Re: Are you all changing tires yet?!

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in new england, state troopers (highway police) call a day after snowstorm an "audi time". Guess why?
If anyone bothered to do data analysis on this winter tire gimmick we might have found out that winter tires + all wheel drive creates overconfidence that leads to more accidents not less.

My gut feeling is that the type of tire provides minute margin of safety that is easily negated by overconfidence such tires impart on a driver, while the style of driving accounts for the most of your chances to survive on the road in adverse cond..

Season tires appear to me nothing more than a marketing ploy otherwise insurance companies around the world would make it mandatory (which is not even a case in ch).

it costs very little as tires last twice as long so your argument is not valid !
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Old 20.03.2019, 12:02
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Re: Are you all changing tires yet?!

The car dealer told me two weeks ago (when I picked up my new car with fresh winter tires) that all season tires do not count as winter tires as far as the police go, and you will be at fault for any wintertime accident. Don't know whether this is true, just repeating what I was told.
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Old 20.03.2019, 12:12
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Re: Are you all changing tires yet?!

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it costs very little as tires last twice as long so your argument is not valid !
We Arent looking for logic or facts here. His gut feelings and twisted thoughts should count just as much as any scientific fact in a discussion…
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  #44  
Old 20.03.2019, 12:14
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Re: Are you all changing tires yet?!

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In New England, state troopers (highway police) call a day after snowstorm an "Audi time". Guess why?
If anyone bothered to do data analysis on this winter tire gimmick we might have found out that winter tires + all wheel drive creates overconfidence that leads to more accidents not less.

My gut feeling is that the type of tire provides minute margin of safety that is easily negated by overconfidence such tires impart on a driver, while the style of driving accounts for the most of your chances to survive on the road in adverse cond..

Season tires appear to me nothing more than a marketing ploy otherwise insurance companies around the World would make it mandatory (which is not even a case in CH).
Almost 10% stopping distance is "minute" to you?

So, you won't mind a 10% pay cut, as it's only minute, or perhaps a 10% increase in taxation? How about 10% less fuel economy?

You're right, today's cars mollycoddle many drivers such that they fail to see the danger involved when they drive like a dickhead... This is, if anything, all the more reason to have 10% more grip when they do get to the edge of the envelope and Newton starts to exert primacy over Turing.

I've driven at the edge (on a closed track) with both summer and winter tires in the wrong season at various times, there is a difference... a huge difference.
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Old 20.03.2019, 13:48
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Re: Are you all changing tires yet?!

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Almost 10% stopping distance is "minute" to you?

So, you won't mind a 10% pay cut, as it's only minute, or perhaps a 10% increase in taxation? How about 10% less fuel economy?

You're right, today's cars mollycoddle many drivers such that they fail to see the danger involved when they drive like a dickhead... This is, if anything, all the more reason to have 10% more grip when they do get to the edge of the envelope and Newton starts to exert primacy over Turing.

I've driven at the edge (on a closed track) with both summer and winter tires in the wrong season at various times, there is a difference... a huge difference.
Where is the figure of 10% coming from? How accurate is it? Is it based on industry statistics and analysis or from a you-tube video of a random guy? If Winter tires are lifesavers where are the statistics to support that assertion from insurance companies or government agencies? Why are Winter tires not mandatory if all your assertions are 100% correct?
Would not Winter tire also allow for faster acceleration in adverse conditions, thereby making it more dangerous?

I am not expecting you to answer these questions, but I surely hope that you would question the veracity of what you've overheard on the internet.
I'll be fine with all-season tires, convenience is more important to me than alleged and unproven margin of safety. Moreover, imho, the driving style and skills are infinitely more important than the type of tire you have.
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Old 20.03.2019, 13:55
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Re: Are you all changing tires yet?!

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but I surely hope that you would question the veracity of what you've overheard on the internet.

Which is exactly what JW was doing
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  #47  
Old 20.03.2019, 13:55
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Re: Are you all changing tires yet?!

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I'll be fine with all-season tires, convenience is more important to me than alleged and unproven margin of safety. Moreover, imho, the driving style and skills are infinitely more important than the type of tire you have.
Just check with your insurance company, as mentioned a few posts ago, all-season may still make you liable for accidents in the winter as they are not winter tires....
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  #48  
Old 20.03.2019, 14:01
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Re: Are you all changing tires yet?!

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Where is the figure of 10% coming from? How accurate is it? Is it based on industry statistics and analysis or from a you-tube video of a random guy? If Winter tires are lifesavers where are the statistics to support that assertion from insurance companies or government agencies? Why are Winter tires not mandatory if all your assertions are 100% correct?
Would not Winter tire also allow for faster acceleration in adverse conditions, thereby making it more dangerous?

I am not expecting you to answer these questions, but I surely hope that you would question the veracity of what you've overheard on the internet.
I'll be fine with all-season tires, convenience is more important to me than alleged and unproven margin of safety. Moreover, imho, the driving style and skills are infinitely more important than the type of tire you have.
Actually, the difference is more than 10%.

Apparently google doesn't work for you.

Here are two:

https://www.tranbc.ca/2016/12/16/why...ng-the-winter/

http://nordicroads.com/comparison-of...s-summer-time/

But whatever, you're obviously an expert.

Nice troll move, "veracity of what you read on the internet" forshadowing the rejection of any link indicating that winter tires are better in winter.

Spent a lot of time behind the wheel have you? Including track time, and skid schools? Ever had to make a compound choice for the next pit stop?

I doubt it.

There's more to tires than them just being round and black.
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Old 20.03.2019, 14:26
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Re: Are you all changing tires yet?!

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There's more to tires than them just being round and black.
Are whitewall tyres for the snow?
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Old 20.03.2019, 14:29
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Re: Are you all changing tires yet?!

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Are whitewall tyres for the snow?
No, they are specifically designed to make a mechanic's life difficult. If you don't believe me, just try and check the wheelbearings on a car with whitewall tires without washing your hands to surgical cleanliness.
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Old 20.03.2019, 14:57
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Re: Are you all changing tires yet?!

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Why are Winter tires not mandatory if all your assertions are 100% correct?
They are, implicitly. You must be in control of your car at all times and drive accordingly, and you must not hinder the other traffic participants. You must equip your car as can reasonably expected to meet those demands. Summer tyres are deemed not suitable for winter conditions.

You may get away with summer tyres in winter if the Föhn is providing for spring temperatures, but if you're involved in an accident on a snowy or ice-covered road with your car having summer tyres on, you'll probably be held at least partially responsible and the insurances may reduce their payments.
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Old 20.03.2019, 15:01
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Re: Are you all changing tires yet?!

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Actually, the difference is more than 10%.

Apparently google doesn't work for you.

Here are two:

https://www.tranbc.ca/2016/12/16/why...ng-the-winter/
This link provides info on all-season tires breaking distances without comparing them to any other tires.
This link compares Winter tires performance in the SUMMER and clearly states that Summer tires are faster in every way and allow for faster acceleration and cornering than Winter tires. - could this be source of accidents when tires are 'faster'? Could faster acceleration negate shorter stopping distance in real driving conditions for Summer tires? Could we conclude that Winter tires in the Summer would be a safer choice as they would force driver to be slower and more cautious?
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But whatever, you're obviously an expert.
I never claimed that. You are the one with all the answers.
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Nice troll move, "veracity of what you read on the internet" forshadowing the rejection of any link indicating that winter tires are better in winter.
No need for name calling, it makes your posts less convincing.
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Spent a lot of time behind the wheel have you? Including track time, and skid schools? Ever had to make a compound choice for the next pit stop?

I doubt it.

There's more to tires than them just being round and black.
Sounds like you are overconfident driver, the type that poses the biggest threat to others.
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Old 20.03.2019, 15:04
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Re: Are you all changing tires yet?!

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Why are Winter tires not mandatory if all your assertions are 100% correct?
In some places (Germany, parts of northern Italy) they are.
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Old 20.03.2019, 15:07
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Re: Are you all changing tires yet?!

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In some places (Germany, parts of northern Italy) they are.
And Austria.
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Old 20.03.2019, 15:09
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Re: Are you all changing tires yet?!

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This link compares Winter tires performance in the SUMMER and clearly states that Summer tires are faster in every way and allow for faster acceleration and cornering than Winter tires. - could this be source of accidents when tires are 'faster'? Could faster acceleration negate shorter stopping distance in real driving conditions for Summer tires? Could we conclude that Winter tires in the Summer would be a safer choice as they would force driver to be slower and more cautious?
By "Faster" do you mean a higher grip threshold? So if you made an evasive twitch of the steering wheel with the winter tyres you'd spin, but with the summer tyres you wouldn't, but you think that spinning would be preferrable?
I don't think we can conclude that having sub par grip is a safer choice in the same way that wearing leather soled shoes on ice means we are more cautious.
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Old 20.03.2019, 15:10
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Re: Are you all changing tires yet?!

Coming late to the party but... does nobody worry about the ICE SAINTS?!
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Old 20.03.2019, 15:11
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Re: Are you all changing tires yet?!

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By "Faster" do you mean a higher grip threshold? So if you made an evasive twitch of the steering wheel with the winter tyres you'd spin, but with the summer tyres you wouldn't, but you think that spinning would be preferrable?
I don't think we can conclude that having sub par grip is a safer choice in the same way that wearing leather soled shoes on ice means we are more cautious.
I think his point was that he is a good driver. I don't think it was a general advice.

Heels make me safer on ice. I slip less.
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Old 20.03.2019, 15:16
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Re: Are you all changing tires yet?!

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I think his point was that he is a good driver. I don't think it was a general advice.

Heels make me safer on ice. I slip less.
Heels make me walk quite cautiously as well, ice or no ice. Although it's a mixture of being cautious that nobody see's me, and that I look like a newborn giraffe.
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Old 20.03.2019, 15:17
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Re: Are you all changing tires yet?!

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Sounds like you are overconfident driver, the type that poses the biggest threat to others.
So... namecalling is out when it's about you, but ok when you invoke it?

As a matter of fact, once you've gone fast on a track, doing it on a public road just loses any allure it might have had. I got my first race permit at 17, in Mosport racetrack. I'm 56. two accidents (neither my fault) and 4 or 5 (I think) speeding tickets, all less than 10 above the posted limit.

It's ok if you think winter tires are a cabal thought up by the manufacturers to dupe simpletons out of their money, just please wear a foil hat while you're driving so I can spot you in my rear view mirror.

I'll ask again, how many defensive driving, and skid school courses have you attended?

How much do you know about physics, suspension geometry, cars in general?

How many people take your advice about tires?

How often do you check the air pressure in your tires?

How often do you inspect your tires for damage?
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Old 20.03.2019, 15:23
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Re: Are you all changing tires yet?!

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Heels make me walk quite cautiously as well, ice or no ice. Although it's a mixture of being cautious that nobody see's me, and that I look like a newborn giraffe.
How about heels on ice and some musical number, while we are at it? (with jazz hands, pls!)

Anyways, I grew up with people riding their tyres to the rims..they probably appreciated the noise/bumps not giving a microsleep any chance.

Safer then? We did roll off a hill once, but it was due to missing road signs.
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