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Old 09.02.2021, 11:39
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Neighbor Illegally Parking - Help!

We have an issue with one of our neighbors in our PPE. Large Albanian clan (I make no judgements - just stating the facts), and the son of the father who rents the flat next door continually parks his car illegally in front of the building house (in an area where it's illegal to park). To add insult to injury, it's literally right in front of our next door neighbor's bedroom window - so she looks out and sees his car, plus gets to enjoy his engine emissions every morning.

I've already tackled the son on this issue, and he just doesn't give a damn. Actually shrugged his shoulders and walked off, saying "It's not a problem - I'm only here for a bit." He isn't. He's parked his car continually here for the last six months overnight. Neighbor in question (with the bedroom) has also tackled him and his father politely. Nothing has happened.

We've phoned the agency who manages our PPE several times now but all they've done is wrung their hands and claim that there's little they can do bar send letters. Really? In any case, letters have already gone around to all PPE residents. No effect. Any suggestions for next steps using the proper channels and without risk of escalation and retaliation?

The arrogance of these people is breathtaking - and when they're not parking illegally on the PPE grounds, they're also taking up the visitor spots as permanent parking spaces. All of this when they could just pay CHF200 to our commune for a street parking permit for the year. It beggars belief.
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Old 09.02.2021, 11:43
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Re: Neighbor Illegally Parking - Help!

a) what is PPE?

b) why don't you call the police?

Tom
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Old 09.02.2021, 11:43
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Re: Neighbor Illegally Parking - Help!

While understanding the frustration of this situation, I think in the end it's the owner of the property who must take action.



Would it be possible to reach out directly to the owner of the building explaining this situation? Just to check, this car is not blocking any kind of emergency exit, fire dept water connector etc? Otherwise it would just be a quick call to the commune instead.
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Old 09.02.2021, 11:52
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Re: Neighbor Illegally Parking - Help!

Hans 1, with a PPE, residents are all owners- and perhaps some rent to third parties, yes? Are you an owner BenVevey?

We had a smilar problem with our PPE in the UK- each apartment sold with 1 dedicated parking space, and 5 spaces left for visitors. This worked well until owners rented to people with 2 cars, who then used the visitor spaces permanently- and who parked in non parking spaces.

We got together as owners, via our PPE association, and wrote a letter to all owners and renters. that visitor spaces had to remain for visitors, and no parking in spaces that were not dedicated to that apartment (they are all clearly numbered). Get together with the other owners and write to the Regie insisting they do the job they are paid for- and get the cars towed if they don't comply.
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Old 09.02.2021, 12:03
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Re: Neighbor Illegally Parking - Help!

Thanks guys - PPE is propriété par etage, basically a shared ownership scheme that's common for condos, at least down here in Romandie. So technically, yes, I'm a part owner - of my apartment (exclusive usage rights), and of a part of the whole of the common grounds.

Development is split into 6 buildings, 4 apparts in each. I own 1. Problem relates to the neighboring building where one owner (local businessman) owns all 4 apparts in the building. He rents 3 out to his fellow countrymen and women, and the other 1 to our neighbor with the bedroom problem - hence why it's delicate for her to complain too hard, as they all know each other.

Good point on fire exits, water connections, etc. I'll check but pretty sure he's OK there. He is blocking an outdoor shed, but this belongs to the owner of this building in the PPE - who I think he's mates with, so that's no problem with him on a day to day.

Is there no recourse to claiming that this is hazardous to our nice neighbor's health, on environmental health grounds?

Getting together as a collective is tough in the current circs. We were due an AGM in March, but I think it's been postponed due to the plague.
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Old 09.02.2021, 12:10
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Re: Neighbor Illegally Parking - Help!

Hi.

I think it's not clear if the guy parking on the street or in some area within the property (PPE grounds)? So, parking in some lawn next to the building?
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Old 09.02.2021, 12:26
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Re: Neighbor Illegally Parking - Help!

If you are an owner, you should be well aware of your rights within the PPE and how to resolve these kind of issues. The PPE agency is responsible to all the owners of the building, and takes actions only on the combined decision of all members, based on a set of rules established in the "reglement" of the PPE (e.g. majority or unanimous decision)

This is usually decided in the PPE assembly, which is v important to take part into and raise grievance at.

If letters don't solve the problem, the only solution is for the PPE entity to hire a security contractor who will enforce fines/impound cars non-conformly parked on the PPE land. For this to happen, usually a majority decision has to be taken in the PPE as it involves quite an expense.

Since from start you are in a minority compared to the "other part" that owns more of the PPE, you face an uphill struggle. You must recruit more PPE owners on your side and force a decision in the assembly

Such are the PPE politics
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Old 09.02.2021, 12:27
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Re: Neighbor Illegally Parking - Help!

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Thanks guys - PPE is propriété par etage, basically a shared ownership scheme that's common for condos, at least down here in Romandie. So technically, yes, I'm a part owner - of my apartment (exclusive usage rights), and of a part of the whole of the common grounds.

Development is split into 6 buildings, 4 apparts in each. I own 1. Problem relates to the neighboring building where one owner (local businessman) owns all 4 apparts in the building. He rents 3 out to his fellow countrymen and women, and the other 1 to our neighbor with the bedroom problem - hence why it's delicate for her to complain too hard, as they all know each other.

Good point on fire exits, water connections, etc. I'll check but pretty sure he's OK there. He is blocking an outdoor shed, but this belongs to the owner of this building in the PPE - who I think he's mates with, so that's no problem with him on a day to day.

Is there no recourse to claiming that this is hazardous to our nice neighbor's health, on environmental health grounds?

Getting together as a collective is tough in the current circs. We were due an AGM in March, but I think it's been postponed due to the plague.

Surely you can ask for the AGM to go ahead on Zoom or similar- we are having a meeting with other owners in the UK next week. But not easy situation if the owner of the whole building rents to acquaintances from his community. Could get 'unpleasant'.
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Old 09.02.2021, 12:37
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Re: Neighbor Illegally Parking - Help!

Shove some bananas in the exhaust, then seal it all in with Araldite
Rent some pet pigeons and get them to shit on his car!
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Old 09.02.2021, 12:43
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Re: Neighbor Illegally Parking - Help!

Wow, the picture really makes the situation clear - parking that close to someone's window is absolutely not OK.

If there are six buildings, the owner of one only has 17% of the voting rights at an AGM.

I'd post exactly that picture on a resolution to the AGM and in each foyer, describing it as anti-social behaviour and damaging to the value of your properties (thus appealing to Swiss morals and owner self-interest) and demanding action.

If I was the owner of the flat in question, I'd probably buy a big plant pot and put it outside the window.
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Old 09.02.2021, 12:48
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Re: Neighbor Illegally Parking - Help!

Ha ha - thanks. I had thought of the big plant pot/planter idea. It's a good point regarding getting the rest of the PPE on board. Certainly also thought of appealing to Swiss owner self-interest. On the grounds you gave, yes, and especially as there is a shortage of parking here and, ultimately, all the rest of us are paying a consideration for our use of either the underground spaces, a few designated outside spaces that are owned and those spaces that we rent from the commune. Whereas this guy - who I don't think is even registered as a resident here - gets a free ride.
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Old 09.02.2021, 12:55
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Re: Neighbor Illegally Parking - Help!

Well thinking of it, there's more than just a big plant pot you could accidentally leave in that location. Here's something my 4 yo might make in less than 15 minutes
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neighbor-illegally-parking-help-screen-shot-2021-02-09-11.53.15.png  
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Old 09.02.2021, 12:58
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Re: Neighbor Illegally Parking - Help!

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Sorry, I should have clarified. It's not the public street, per se. Our private property has an access lane (with paving stones) that runs along the side of our PPE, and allows passage for La Poste van, people to load and unload things from our apartments, etc. But it certainly isn't a designated parking area. Attached a photo so you can see for yourselves.
Thanks for the clarification, but maybe erase the photo in a few hours. You never know....

I guess it's not a street parking offense. Environmental grounds? Only if the engine is idling for a long time. Maybe complaining about noise gets more support for other PPE owners. Or does the car exhaust is leaving a smoke stain on the white wall? That smoke stain would be a great base for a complain.

As newtoswitz mentioned, if it's possible to park a car, it's also possible to place a big plant and wait for someone to complain
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Old 09.02.2021, 13:12
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Re: Neighbor Illegally Parking - Help!

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Certainly also thought of appealing to Swiss owner self-interest.
That would be your most strong fighting tool. The owners of the other flats have a direct interest to not allow this kind of behaviour - as this is directly hitting the value of the PPE property, even if further away. The Swiss are masters for raising hell for any kinds of neighbourhood issues - and this is far for being a small issue.

How much does one have to pay for a parking space in that area (must be about 20k at least to buy one). Surely the other building owner has enough spaces to rent out - and if not, other owners probably have spaces they can rent for the right amount of money.

I would advise against any vigilante type retaliation, particularly considering the area and the people involved.
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Old 09.02.2021, 13:44
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Re: Neighbor Illegally Parking - Help!

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Sorry, I should have clarified. It's not the public street, per se. Our private property has an access lane (with paving stones) that runs along the side of our PPE, and allows passage for La Poste van, people to load and unload things from our apartments, etc. But it certainly isn't a designated parking area. Attached a photo so you can see for yourselves.
Why do you consider parking as on the photo to be illegal? There is no "No Parking" sign that I can see. Even if there were one, unless it is forbidden by Court order (in Zurich, it would be written Amtliches or Richtliches verbot, or similar with Court order number) there is little you can do.
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Old 09.02.2021, 13:45
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Re: Neighbor Illegally Parking - Help!

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Large Albanian clan

move.


case closed.
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Old 09.02.2021, 13:50
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Re: Neighbor Illegally Parking - Help!

The person with the window should start using a chamber pot and empty the contents out her window a few times a day.

Tom
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Old 09.02.2021, 13:52
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Re: Neighbor Illegally Parking - Help!

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Sorry, I should have clarified. It's not the public street, per se. Our private property has an access lane (with paving stones) that runs along the side of our PPE, and allows passage for La Poste van, people to load and unload things from our apartments, etc. But it certainly isn't a designated parking area. Attached a photo so you can see for yourselves.
Wait until the car is gone and park your own car there for 2 weeks.
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Old 09.02.2021, 13:53
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Re: Neighbor Illegally Parking - Help!

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That would be your most strong fighting tool. The owners of the other flats have a direct interest to not allow this kind of behaviour - as this is directly hitting the value of the PPE property, even if further away. The Swiss are masters for raising hell for any kinds of neighbourhood issues - and this is far for being a small issue.

How much does one have to pay for a parking space in that area (must be about 20k at least to buy one). Surely the other building owner has enough spaces to rent out - and if not, other owners probably have spaces they can rent for the right amount of money.

I would advise against any vigilante type retaliation, particularly considering the area and the people involved.
Yes, 30k for an interior parking, 15-20k for exterior. Certainly not going to take vigilante action or escalate things further on a personal level. Moving in the future? Yes, certainly - 3-4 years to Berne. Much prefer the German-speaking part and wife is from Zurich. Currently work for a multinational in the region, so Vaud suits me for now
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Old 09.02.2021, 14:05
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Re: Neighbor Illegally Parking - Help!

If it's about emissions, which is a valid complaint, explain and ask them to park the other way around, but I suspect it's frustration that someone is getting a parking space for free. You could buy a very cheap car and park it up in that space permanently when it's free. Then it's someone else's problem to get the car moved. If a ruling then ever happens that it's illegal (according to your PPE) to park there, it would also be illegal for the Albanian guy to park there. I would suspect however that the car would probably go missing one day.
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