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  #21  
Old 16.04.2011, 12:43
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Re: Comparison of Swisscom vs. Cablecom

well, i agree on the vdsl part. ftth (fibre to the home) still shares the connection (as all the services are ip-based!) but the profile you receive is much higher. in my router i have currently a 200'000/200'000 kbit profile. thats more than enough for 16 hd stream. and that is for only for now. ftth can have multiple gbit in both directions, impossible over cable aswell.
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  #22  
Old 16.04.2011, 14:10
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Re: Comparison of Swisscom vs. Cablecom

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well, i agree on the vdsl part. ftth (fibre to the home) still shares the connection (as all the services are ip-based!) but the profile you receive is much higher. in my router i have currently a 200'000/200'000 kbit profile. thats more than enough for 16 hd stream. and that is for only for now. ftth can have multiple gbit in both directions, impossible over cable aswell.
...how did you find out your router profile speed ? Do you have a screenshot I can see ? I am interested in that claim...

P.S. Do not confuse cable with being just copper either. Both Swisscom and Cablecom have (are rolling out) FTTP infrastructure, and I doubt very much you have access to FTTH. Even then, what sort of connection do you have from your devices ? Co-ax and copper...

Cablecom has massive advantages over Swisscom, in terms of infrastructure and overlying technology. You are indeed very confused if you try to argue technically in favour of Swisscom. Docsis is romping ahead of DSL.
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  #23  
Old 16.04.2011, 14:20
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Re: Comparison of Swisscom vs. Cablecom

The 50meg Swisscom connection is cable though. I know because it's not available in Neuchatel just like cablecom isn't
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  #24  
Old 16.04.2011, 14:30
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Re: Comparison of Swisscom vs. Cablecom

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The 50meg Swisscom connection is cable though. I know because it's not available in Neuchatel just like cablecom isn't
no, its ftth, not cable.
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  #25  
Old 16.04.2011, 14:34
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Re: Comparison of Swisscom vs. Cablecom

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The 50meg Swisscom connection is cable though. I know because it's not available in Neuchatel just like cablecom isn't
Distances usually determine the availability of the higher speed DSL packages. It is most likely you are too far from the cabinet to be offered this speed. Swisscom uses DSL technology, Cablecom use Docsis. DSL is heavily dependant on the distance to the cabinet as DSL speeds degrade terribly over distance. Both Swisscom and Cablecom use cable infrastructure, it's the way they use it that is different. (cables being copper or fibre).
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  #26  
Old 16.04.2011, 14:44
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Re: Comparison of Swisscom vs. Cablecom

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...how did you find out your router profile speed ? Do you have a screenshot I can see ? I am interested in that claim...

P.S. Do not confuse cable with being just copper either. Both Swisscom and Cablecom have (are rolling out) FTTP infrastructure, and I doubt very much you have access to FTTH. Even then, what sort of connection do you have from your devices ? Co-ax and copper...

Cablecom has massive advantages over Swisscom, in terms of infrastructure and overlying technology. You are indeed very confused if you try to argue technically in favour of Swisscom. Docsis is romping ahead of DSL.
well, comparing docsis 3.0 to xdsl, docsis 3 is romping ahead, but comparing docsis vs. Fibre to the Home (FTTH) is a complete different story.

my connection: Swisscom installed last year in our house a Fibre outlet. There my router is connected over a optical fibre cable. from this router, we have 4 cat. 6 cables connecting the house (other router, swisscom tv boxes). this is up and running since a few weeks (long story). they started last year in basel connecting all houses with fibre.

cablecom is spending a lot more money into advertising "fibre power" than actually investing into building a proper FTTH network without the problems docsis have with the bottlenecks in the headends. they are maybe coming closer to the homes (they have to, otherwise 100mbit will be the last step), but why not directly invest into a proper to the home network?
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  #27  
Old 16.04.2011, 14:48
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Re: Comparison of Swisscom vs. Cablecom

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Distances usually determine the availability of the higher speed DSL packages. It is most likely you are too far from the cabinet to be offered this speed. Swisscom uses DSL technology, Cablecom use Docsis. DSL is heavily dependant on the distance to the cabinet as DSL speeds degrade terribly over distance. Both Swisscom and Cablecom use cable infrastructure, it's the way they use it that is different. (cables being copper or fibre).
guess that was the confusion. in german, when someones is talking about "kabelnetzwerk" he normally to revers to the coaxial cable from cablecompanys like cablecom.

ah, and swisscom doesnt offer 50mbit over vdsl. that wouldnt make sense as maybe 1% of the vdsl subscribers would actually have the possibilty to get this speed.

Last edited by daveAust; 16.04.2011 at 14:51. Reason: addition
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  #28  
Old 16.04.2011, 14:53
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Re: Comparison of Swisscom vs. Cablecom

FTTH is the infrastructure. This can have DSL or Docsis running on top of it.

Cablecom and Swisscom both offer FTTH (or more probably/currently FTTP for apartments). If you have a house , you can get FTTP. Thus, all things being equal at the infrastructure level, DOCSIS will always beat xDSL.

Also, where are you getting your information from about Docsis 3 congestion at the headend ? It's a myth as far as Cablecom are concerned.
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  #29  
Old 16.04.2011, 15:24
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Re: Comparison of Swisscom vs. Cablecom

Swisscom is installing in every appartmant 4 fibres. I would call this FTTH. There is no electrical cable between the Headend and the Router. All is straight over fibre! Point to Point (or, proper FTTH). I havent seen such an implemention from cablecoms side in a wider area. FTTH beats Docsis/xDSL handsdown, nearly in every aspect (exept for the investments now).
http://seekingalpha.com/article/1237...docsis-vs-vdsl

and, concerning congestions. By personal experience in our former appartment, during peak hours, my 25mbit connection couldnt max out (10-15mbit max). fair enough, i dont know if it was already docsis 3.0 or 2.
another source would be a local forum: http://www.cablemodem.ch/messageboard/messageboard.html
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  #30  
Old 16.04.2011, 15:41
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Re: Comparison of Swisscom vs. Cablecom

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Swisscom is installing in every appartmant 4 fibres. I would call this FTTH. There is no electrical cable between the Headend and the Router. All is straight over fibre! Point to Point (or, proper FTTH). I havent seen such an implemention from cablecoms side in a wider area. FTTH beats Docsis/xDSL handsdown, nearly in every aspect (exept for the investments now).
http://seekingalpha.com/article/1237...docsis-vs-vdsl

and, concerning congestions. By personal experience in our former appartment, during peak hours, my 25mbit connection couldnt max out (10-15mbit max). fair enough, i dont know if it was already docsis 3.0 or 2.
another source would be a local forum: http://www.cablemodem.ch/messageboard/messageboard.html

Why do you keep on about FTTH beating xDSL or DOCSIS ???

The other aricle touts DSL and DOCSIS over CoAx/Copper vs x over FTTH so it is irrelevant to this discussion. We are comparing Cablecom DOCSIS over fibre to Swisscom's DSL over fibre.

As I have said above , FTTH is the infrastructure. DOCSIS and xDSL run on top of that. You still have DSL over Fibre. You do not have FTTH beating xDSL or DOCSIS.

Do you have the specific message thread for congestion on Cablecoms network ?

Also, I am still interested in how you think your router is set to 200k/200k...

The real test as to what you have at home is to look at your modem/router, do you have the make and model number, I assume it is a DSL modem/router ?

Last edited by Upthehatters2008; 16.04.2011 at 15:58.
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  #31  
Old 16.04.2011, 17:34
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Re: Comparison of Swisscom vs. Cablecom

ok, thanks to your input I learned a lot!
intially i wanted to compare cablecom's "fibre power" with "FTTH" from swisscom.

since the last time i was checking they went down to a 100k/100k profile (not that it matters, 50mbit + 3*hd stream is still less than 100k). it is a Pirelli Centro Grande Router (ADSL/VDSL/Fibre Compatible).

http://img33.imageshack.us/i/centrod.jpg/
anyway, why you think that docsis over fibre is superior to "xdsl" over fibre?
by the way, i dont think that swisscom is running xdsl on fibre connections, there are as i have seen much better alternatives.
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  #32  
Old 16.04.2011, 19:35
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Re: Comparison of Swisscom vs. Cablecom

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ok, thanks to your input I learned a lot!
intially i wanted to compare cablecom's "fibre power" with "FTTH" from swisscom.

since the last time i was checking they went down to a 100k/100k profile (not that it matters, 50mbit + 3*hd stream is still less than 100k). it is a Pirelli Centro Grande Router (ADSL/VDSL/Fibre Compatible).

http://img33.imageshack.us/i/centrod.jpg/
anyway, why you think that docsis over fibre is superior to "xdsl" over fibre?
by the way, i dont think that swisscom is running xdsl on fibre connections, there are as i have seen much better alternatives.
What cable / lead do you use to go from the router to the wall socket ? Fibre or copper ?

To answer your question about which is best, I first need to clarify whether you have DSL over Fibre or pure FTTH. The type of connection from your router to the wall will deterrmine this. It's quite possible that you are the first of a new Swisscom FTTH rollout judging by your screenshot but I cannot determine whether this is sDSL or FTTH.
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  #33  
Old 16.04.2011, 19:45
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Re: Comparison of Swisscom vs. Cablecom

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Distances usually determine the availability of the higher speed DSL packages. It is most likely you are too far from the cabinet to be offered this speed. Swisscom uses DSL technology, Cablecom use Docsis. DSL is heavily dependant on the distance to the cabinet as DSL speeds degrade terribly over distance. Both Swisscom and Cablecom use cable infrastructure, it's the way they use it that is different. (cables being copper or fibre).
I'm pretty sure on the phone they said the 50meg (which can be upgraded to 100meg) is fibre optic.

http://labs.swisscom.ch/en/content/m...nternet-surfen

The value isn't as good as cablecom for sure though.
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  #34  
Old 16.04.2011, 20:03
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Re: Comparison of Swisscom vs. Cablecom

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You forget one key comparision:

As soon as you watch TV on Swisscom, your internet speed drops.
Watch 2 TVs on Swisscom, and your Internet is basically near zero

With Cablecom you can have as many TVs as you want with no impact on Internet speed
No it doesn't well not for me anyway. Both tv channels on still leaves 10meg which is more than enough.
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  #35  
Old 16.04.2011, 20:09
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Re: Comparison of Swisscom vs. Cablecom

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What cable / lead do you use to go from the router to the wall socket ? Fibre or copper ?

To answer your question about which is best, I first need to clarify whether you have DSL over Fibre or pure FTTH. The type of connection from your router to the wall will deterrmine this. It's quite possible that you are the first of a new Swisscom FTTH rollout judging by your screenshot but I cannot determine whether this is sDSL or FTTH.
as I said before, its proper FTTH, no electrical (cupper) cable in between. the cable from wall to the router is a fibre cable looking like .
swisscom started with this in 2008, we are not the first...
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  #36  
Old 16.04.2011, 21:33
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Re: Comparison of Swisscom vs. Cablecom

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as I said before, its proper FTTH, no electrical (cupper) cable in between. the cable from wall to the router is a fibre cable looking like ].
swisscom started with this in 2008, we are not the first...
So you have the vDSL router with the cable fibre adaptors...

Seems, your are running vDSL over fibre (FTTH on the last mile)
The router you mentioned is a DSL router
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  #37  
Old 16.04.2011, 21:39
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Re: Comparison of Swisscom vs. Cablecom

Out of interest, can you post a screenshot of your speeds under Swisscom's Speed test page.

Here is my Cablecom connection results using Swisscom's preferred tool...


comparison-swisscom-vs-cablecom-fp100.jpg
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  #38  
Old 17.04.2011, 02:19
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Re: Comparison of Swisscom vs. Cablecom

i dont think swisscom is that stupid and runs xdsl over fibre. Whereas it would work, it doesnt make any sense to run DSL over fibre. i have no exact source but i think they put GPON over it (at least in the doc below they are talking about GPON as possibilty for resellers).
http://ec.europa.eu/information_soci...scom_v_def.pdf

the router is xDSL compatible, but it has a optical port aswell! No adaptor required, as it is the ONT!


Speedtest, measured over WLAN...:

Last edited by daveAust; 17.04.2011 at 02:52.
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  #39  
Old 17.04.2011, 03:50
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Re: Comparison of Swisscom vs. Cablecom

Of Course they are running DSL over fibre, It's called vDSL2, the whole backbone is being upgraded to fibre, and FTTH means the last mile to the home is also fibre, as opposed to FTTC, where the last mile might be copper... You have a DSL modem. You have DSL over fibre , why will you not believe this ?
The only difference between DOCSIS (HFC) and what you have is the fact that there is no conversion at the node from fibre to RF (coax), but with FTTH simply having fibre all the way. Cablecom are FTTN and then DOCSIS to the premises. Over your fibre, between the last fibre node and the premises you are running the DSL protocol, whereas Cablecom run DOCSIS to get from the last node to the home.

You have a DSL modem , with a fibre adaptor. Come on, get your head out of the sand. Or perhaps you might like to tell me what protocol you are running on your fibre connection and what your modem is actually demodulating ?

BTW, your profile seems to have gone from 200k to 100k and then to 50k during the last 24 hours....what has happened ? Also your speed seems to have dropped from 8.5MB/s to 6MB/s...

Last edited by Upthehatters2008; 17.04.2011 at 04:09.
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  #40  
Old 17.04.2011, 09:35
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Re: Comparison of Swisscom vs. Cablecom

I am customer of cablecom since 1 week now, and can tell direct: wow !! Incredible speed and everything runs smooth with service. I would recommend it !
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