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Old 25.04.2013, 22:57
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Why do I get charged when someone doesn't leave a voicemail? [Orange]

A couple of weeks ago I was on holiday in Italy when someone from the UK tried calling me on my mobile 3 times in a day. As I knew who it was and that I wasn't interested, I ignored it.

I then received a text message from Orange to say that my automatic top-up had been invoked as the balance had dropped below the threshold that I've set on their website. This struck me as odd because I hadn't made any calls - I hadn't even answered any calls.

So I checked on the website last week and found that I had been charged for 1 minute of use for each of those unanswered calls, which the website said were from Switzerland, even though they had a UK number.

I wrote to Orange to ask why I had been charged for these 3 calls, and their response makes me a little bit angry.

Orange tell me that I get charged for someone using my voicemail while I'm in a different country. They added that the number shows up as a Swiss number because that's where my voicemail is (eh?). And even if they don't leave a voicemaill message, a charge is incurred as soon as their call is diverted to voicemail.

Oh, and because I'm in a different country, I'm charged by the minute rather than seconds.

So let's get this straight: Someone from the UK called my Swiss mobile number; When it went to voicemail they hung up; and I'm the one who gets charged for them calling me for a minute each time?

It's not the actual charge that bothers me, it's the fact that I get charged for someone calling my voicemail, when they didn't even leave a message.

Is it just me or does anyone else think this is a farcical rip-off?
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Old 25.04.2013, 23:17
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Re: Why do I get charged when someone doesn't leave a voicemail? [Orange]

I have 2 mobiles, one for friends and one for everyone else. I only take one abroad and switch the other off.
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Old 25.04.2013, 23:23
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Re: Why do I get charged when someone doesn't leave a voicemail? [Orange]

If you are out of country, you pay 3x, end of story.

I'm too lazy to look up the reasons why, get off your lazy ass and do it yourself!

Tom
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Old 25.04.2013, 23:28
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Re: Why do I get charged when someone doesn't leave a voicemail? [Orange]

So you are complaoning for receiving 3 calls that you were too lazy to answer, any normal person knows telcos make their money a fortune out of roaming.
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Old 25.04.2013, 23:30
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Re: Why do I get charged when someone doesn't leave a voicemail? [Orange]

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It's not the actual charge that bothers me, it's the fact that I get charged for someone calling my voicemail, when they didn't even leave a message.
Unfortunately that's the way roaming works.

When roaming you should always disable call forwarding 'when busy' and 'when unanswered'. Otherwise the foreign network will forward your call back to your voicemail in Switzerland which causes a completed (and therefore chargeable) international call from Switzerland to Italy (in your case) and back to Switzerland.
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Old 25.04.2013, 23:32
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Re: Why do I get charged when someone doesn't leave a voicemail? [Orange]

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Unfortunately that's the way roaming works.

When roaming you should always disable call forwarding 'when busy' or 'when unanswered'. Otherwise the foreign network will forward your call back your voicemail in Switzerland which causes a completed (and hence chargeable) international call from Switzerland to Italy (in your case) and back to Switzerland.
Thanks, I was to lazy to write that.

Anyway, to avoid this, turn off you mbx whenever you are not in your home network.

Tom
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Old 25.04.2013, 23:32
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Re: Why do I get charged when someone doesn't leave a voicemail? [Orange]

But if you don't answer the call, knowing you would pay roaming to do so, doesn't mean that it is common knowledge that you get charged roaming for voice mail. I need to look into this...as many things mobile are foreign to me due to lack of use!


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Unfortunately that's the way roaming works.

When roaming you should always disable call forwarding 'when busy' or 'when unanswered'. Otherwise the foreign network will forward your call back to your voicemail in Switzerland which causes a completed (and therefore chargeable) international call from Switzerland to Italy (in your case) and back to Switzerland.
Thanks! Time to explore my cell phone
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Old 25.04.2013, 23:35
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Re: Why do I get charged when someone doesn't leave a voicemail? [Orange]

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But if you don't answer the call, knowing you would pay roaming to do so, doesn't mean that it is common knowledge that you get charged roaming for voice mail.
OK, easy explanation:

No answer, no charge.

BUT: goes to voicemail, 3x charge!

Turn off your voicemail when not in home network!

Tom

P.S. Anyone who thinks this is bad, what about that in the US the receiving party is also charged!
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Old 25.04.2013, 23:46
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Re: Why do I get charged when someone doesn't leave a voicemail? [Orange]

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OK, easy explanation:

No answer, no charge.

BUT: goes to voicemail, 3x charge!

Turn off your voicemail when not in home network!

Tom

P.S. Anyone who thinks this is bad, what about that in the US the receiving party is also charged!
Yea, that is dumb in the US. I went to check my voice mail but either I haven't activated it or I don't have it. Well, have only had this number/phone for 1.5 months...
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Old 26.04.2013, 00:31
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Re: Why do I get charged when someone doesn't leave a voicemail? [Orange]

the problem described is called "voice tromboning", and it is a known problem in the GSMA specs.

It happens because the voice channel is established (therefore a caller hear ringing; this means there is a voice channel reserved). After several rings, there is a call redirection (to your voice mail), hence the 2nd voice channel (from visited country to home country's voice mail) is established.

The fact that this happens (and it looks like a trombone, going long way forward and back) creates CDR (call detail record) in the visited network. This CDR is then passed on to Orange (as part of monthly settlement), therefore you receive a charge for "0 seconds voice call".

Note that there is an EU directive against such charges. But we are not in EU

Cheers!
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Old 30.05.2013, 12:58
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Re: Why do I get charged when someone doesn't leave a voicemail? [Orange]

You know what sucks!
I was in the Netherlands. Phone off.
Someone calls me but gets voicemail.
Somehow didn't 'hang up' the phone.
Left an 1+ hour message on my voicemail.
At almost 3CHF per minute
BOOM 170 CHF on my invoice.

ps. For receiving voicemail they cahrge you:

1. Calling to local when abroad
2. Receiving a call when abroad

(check your invoice, you'll see the exact same minutes showing up on both parts)
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Old 30.05.2013, 13:04
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Re: Why do I get charged when someone doesn't leave a voicemail? [Orange]

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You know what sucks!
I was in the Netherlands. Phone off.
Someone calls me but gets voicemail.
Somehow didn't 'hang up' the phone.
Left an 1+ hour message on my voicemail.
At almost 3CHF per minute
BOOM 170 CHF on my invoice.

ps. For receiving voicemail they cahrge you:

1. Calling to local when abroad
2. Receiving a call when abroad

(check your invoice, you'll see the exact same minutes showing up on both parts)

ps. I finally signed up on this forum after having it used countless number of times passively (every time google something regarding CH in English, this site pops up! ).

I'm Tom and live in Zurich. Cheers
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Old 30.05.2013, 13:49
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Re: Why do I get charged when someone doesn't leave a voicemail? [Orange]

If you turned your mobile OFF then you shouldn't be charged anything.

The local network in the country you're visiting should know your phone is off and when someone calls you, the network in the country your mobile is registered in diverts straight to voicemail, not bouncing in and out of the country you're visiting.

That's how it's always worked for me.

You should only be charged if your phone rings and you divert it to voicemail (either manually or automatically after a timeout).
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